Thread: The Road to 5.0

Originally Posted by KageTokage

I'm kind of curious as to how the Shadowhunter has been so effective at locating and exterminating the Ascians since they tend to be very subtle with their methods for the most part.

Well given who he's strongly implied to be (and I have no reason to suspect he's anyone else other than Gaius), it's been more or less two whole expansions between his previous appearance before 4.3. I'm inclined to believe there's a lot he's been up to behind the scenes in all that time. It probably won't be too much longer until we learn what he's discovered about the Ascians since then. I'm anxious to see what 4.5 brings.

Originally Posted by KageTokage

I'm kind of curious as to how the Shadowhunter has been so effective at locating and exterminating the Ascians since they tend to be very subtle with their methods for the most part.

They're not just subtle - the Overlords in particular would be a menacing threat to anyone who isn't the WoL and protected by Hydaelyn/benefiting from a more powerful Echo than most. More than a match for Gaius, for sure. It's important not to forget that the only reason we're able to rival the Overlords is that we're quite similar in some ways. Unless he and his posse - since it isn't just him - have some means of detaching them from their host without the need to engage them directly. It could also be that there is a "traitor" in their midst. Elidibus had said to Varis he wasn't too bothered about the dark robed Ascians being removed. What if they have become more obstacle than aid to Elidibus?


TBH, there's a lot of questions floating about, because if you think about the repercussions of Zodiark not being evil, and the majority of Ascians being wrong about what it takes to revive him, it would imply that they were acting much like the WoL on the First, i.e. interpreting his wishes as they saw fit, and in the process furthering the expansion of darkness, until they realised you can go too far with it, with some just wanting to see the world burn. They are creatures of darkness, so destruction is in their fiber.

Where I think things get messy is that the voice communing with the WoL appeared after Y'shtola manipulated the device in the Steppes. I don't think it's coincidental. You then have to wonder, what is this device's true nature (perhaps it's more to do with the flood of aether than anything specific to the device), and if it is Zodiark's voice, why did he not just appeal directly to Elidibus? The Ascian echo must be connected to him in the same way ours is to Hydaelyn; so is he already apprised of matters, and now it's just a case of bringing the WoL on board? Is Elidibus, in turn, just trying to use a military confrontation as a means of proving a point? Furthermore, if we're wrong about Zodiark's nature, why has Hydaelyn never corrected our understanding of matters? Even just to say the Ascians are ignorant of what truly would be required to revive him. Yet, if they're correct, cooperation with him will have to be conducted on very cautious terms. I have a strong feeling that we may find out that most of the Overlords are wrong about Zodiark, and Elidibus is privy to this knowledge but has to act very carefully, lest he draw their ire and they question his status as Emissary. In that case, why is Solus different to the rest?

IMO, the fanfest was meant to mislead a little, in that the 'war' with the Empire will end pretty fast once it has served its purpose and brought you and Elidibus into contact. The main focus is going to be the twin calamities. I suspect our involvement in the Empire, for 5.0, will be just enough to deal with Solus and a proper visit to Garlemald won't be forthcoming till 6.0, when they can do the imperial territories - Ilsabard - more justice. Whether we are witnessing flashes of the future, or travelling to the First, or dealing with a calamity on the Source, the sequence in the trailer will probably be the reverse and follow on from the aftermath of the Ghimlyt Dark.

I'm eager to see if we will come across those creatures which the statues in Amdapor are based on. Maybe worlds seared by light aren't that bereft of some life forms, after all.

I'm kinda ready for SE to completely mess with our understanding of Zodiark and Hydaelyn.

As an interesting little aside, that "throw wide the gates" line is said by Loffrey in the Orbonne Monastery Vaults in FF:T. They don't typically tie raid content to the MSQ, but I just found that tidbit intriguing what with Orbonne coming in 4.5.

Originally Posted by Theodric

I wouldn't be terribly surprised if Return to Ivalice ends up being mandatory to advance the MSQ's. Or, at the very least, it'll have major changes to dialogue based on whether or not it has been completed.

NAH. It's only about as relevant to the MSQ as CT was, and, well, yeah (but if the leaks are true...). We might even go an entire version without it coming up again, though they have gotten better about that lately.


Which is not to say that there's any strong reason it can't happen, per se, without bringing in my most-loathed argument of "side vs. main content" (which has no place in discussions of world and story details, IMO), just that our current precedents have shown that it probably won't even if it really probably should.

Originally Posted by Theodric

I'm pleased to see more people coming around to the theories surrounding Hydaelyn that Lauront and I have been putting forth ever since Minfilia was first spirited away.

Originally Posted by Theodric

I'm still of the belief that Hydaelyn cannot be trusted. <...> The imagery and actions surrounding her possession of Minfilia, however, definitely reminds me of a parasite though.

I've long said that I believe Hydaelyn is trustworthy, but flawed, and I've long left the door open for Zodiark to not be quite what He seems while pressing my belief that His agents, if accurately acting as a representation of His goals, must be cast down. I for one not "coming around" to the idea that She's the parasite Lahabrea made her out to be, and would be very uncomfortable with being (mis)represented as such. If anything, I'm more vehemently Team Hydaelyn and Team Elidibus is a Snake than ever, if for no other reason but because I enjoy riding that train off a cliff if that's where it goes.

I still believe that Minfilia consented. Minfilia knew Hydaelyn was weak, knew what she believed would befall our world if She died, and was eager to do everything she could for Eorzea's benefit, even sacrificing her life to act as Hydaelyn's voice to change the future. It wasn't this grand betrayal, kidnapping, and murder-by-Mothercrystal.

Debates about topics such as Hydaelyn's "trustworthiness" have been as specific as they have been bitter; very quick to write off everything they got wrong to cling to what can be spun as, look at me, I called it. For the record, I'd be very nervous for it to be assumed I have a dog in this race, lol. I'm here to have fun, to be supportive, to build community, and to celebrate writing that I enjoy.


EDIT: Apologies if this came off in any way as a specific call-out. It's not about any specific theories or people; it's the attitude of debate, not the popularity of its content. I'm still hyper-vigilant after About the Emperor led to me getting over a dozen in-game tells and Discord PMs lamenting the dragging of negativity from previous threads to make later ones especially hostile. The lore forum has never been subject to making things emotional and personal, even when debates went on for pages about the soundness of an idea.

Yup, I'd be very pleased if they did find a way to tie the two together.