We Really Need To Talk About The State And Path Of FFXIV

[Hamada]

This was exactly why they put the lock on the accessories, it also ties in to what I’m going to say below.

As an aside about the i270 stuff, the funny thing was, is that raiders were fully prepared to go into Deltascape with i270 Alexandrian accessories because the accessories at the time did not have STR on them. It wasn’t uncommon to see tanks in Expert Roulette wearing their Alexandrian right side.



My honest opinion of this is that the developers have a vision in their head of how we are supposed to play, and when a group goes against that vision (e.g., tanks in DPS stance never touching their aggro combo), the developers don’t tend to like that, as it ruins their vision. So, they implement things to try and stop the behavior: removing the ability equip STR jewelry (or even removing it entirely from tank accessories, as it was when 4.0 launched); trying to add additional affects/potencies to skills under [tank stance] effect to make them use tank stance (there is a DRK ability that makes it seem like it would do more damage in Grit, but it actually doesn’t once you factor in damage penalties from turning Grit on); etc.. But, they eventually realize it’s a pointless endeavor, so they “cave” and try to compromise. Sadly, the compromise is still not enough (at least with regards to tank accessories).
Now, behavior like this is more common in NA, but it is certainly not limited to NA only; JP cares just as much about optimization and a certain website as NA does (heck, a lot of the top runs in terms of damage and skill tend to be by JP players most of the time). The JP side of it is just less blunt and direct, from what I understand (and that falls in line with how they typically are culturally).

I really do not get what you are trying to tell me or add to my post. i did explain they later added str so why point out something like " accessories at the time did not have STR on them" to me?

Same with the second part,, why are you talking about who optimization what and where? That is not the issue im talking about. What I am talking about is that they are out of touch (at least with the NA population) with people cheesing out entering the duty finder. They did not change jewelry to curb this, they ONLY did the change to the jewelry because of tanks wearing STR gear, NOT people cheesing the duty finder, wearing stuff that does not apply to your job at all. Also SB has not curb people doing this:




So this goes way back to this and why this was started:

Oh THOSE. Yeah the devs need to take action with that as well. They seem to have a big problem with changing anything that isn't the new thing. Tanks up to SB can still wear STR accessories, but also everything else. Again, another oversight by the loveable devs. Or maybe not an oversight. Just didn't care.

The real answer is, they are ignoring a NA player base problem. does anyone really know if the Japanese player base have players frequently cheesing the duty finder requirements?

I AM SO LOST RIGHT NOW! You already responded to my quote last page but now you're responding to the same quote with a totally different response that doesn't correctly respond to my quote @_@. I never said SB fixed the ilvl issue I said that SB fixed the "All Classes" issue with DoW players putting on magic gear, since all gear in SB is job-locked.

IT DID NOT THOUGH!!! you can still enter SB dungeons in 50 and below "all class" crafter gear.

[Magic-Mal]

IT DID NOT THOUGH!!! you can still enter SB dungeons in 50 and below "all class" crafter gear.

THAT'S MY POINT!! I don't think you're realizing that we're talking about the same gearing issue with the "All Classes" tag.

SB fixed the issue with SB GEAR meaning SB gear doesn't have any gear with "All Classes". That was my point!!! And I specifically pointed out how it was an issue because ARR gear and HW gear WEREN'T FIXED!

[HyoMinPark]

snip

Calm down; I’m literally only building off of points you already provided, as well as providing a counterargument into why I personally think they added in the job lock to accessories—it is, in a way, to prevent tanks from using STR accessories; but that also comes from the developer’s way they think tanks should be played in this game (i.e., always in tank stance, always using their enmity combos, etc.).

I personally don’t think the change came from making it easier on healers to heal, as I never had issues healing STR tanks in HW (and I’m not a healer main, nor was I a Savage raider back then—I only did Ex trials up until the final months of Creator). With the change to tank damage scaling off of VIT in 3.4, there was no issues healing tanks then. But that change was reverted thanks to changing in how Weakness/Brink of Death functioned, which was already discussed several pages back (so I’m not going to rehash it now).

Not everything is an attack on your posts.


EDIT: If you would like me to specifically address DF queue cheesing, then there is a simple solution to this: regardless of the gear one is currently wearing, if their job meets the level requirements for a duty, they will always have the chance of landing in that duty (e.g., a person is level 70, but they don’t want to get Swallow’s Compass so they attempt to remove gear too lower their item level so it does not pop—but the Duty Finder ignores this and puts them in the queue for it anyways, as they have unlocked it and they meet the base level requirement for it; it would also help if the game was able to recognize “They’ve cleared this content before” to also add another layer of ignoring item level manipulations).

[Hamada]

THAT'S MY POINT!! I don't think you're realizing that we're talking about the same gearing issue with the "All Classes" tag

You said SB fixed it. I am saying it did not because you still can enter SB dungeons with that gear. Because you can do this, SB did not fix anything. You are simply missing my point that I am disagreeing on SB fixing anything since you can still do it for ALL DUNGEONS under 70. For the level 70 dungeons with ilevel requirements where be hard to meet them sloting that low gear. You can still carry the left side, by high ilevel on the right, and doing this you still may be undergeared for the dungeon and straining your other 3 party members. SE seems to not understand this issue since it was never addressed. the right side for SB the new right side SB gear was only done because of tanks wearing str gear, has nothing to do with the NA player base wearing flat out wrong gear and cheesing the duty finder.

Calm down; I’m literally only building off of points you already provided, as well as providing a counterargument into why I personally think they added in the job lock to accessories—it is, in a way, to prevent tanks from using STR accessories; but that also comes from the developer’s way they think tanks should be played in this game (i.e., always in tank stance, always using their enmity combos, etc.).

Not everything is an attack on your posts.

Na it is fine, I was.. just confused... what the point was.

[van_arn]

The problem is we, as a community, permit people in terrible gear because it's "mean" to kick someone with a level 50 weapon in Mettle or the autoattacking black mage in Doma Castle.

It's our fault.

[Magic-Mal]

You said SB fixed it. I am saying it did not because you still can enter SB dungeons with that gear. Because you can do this, SB did not fix anything. You are simply missing my point that I am disagreeing on SB fixing anything since you can still do it for ALL DUNGEONS under 70.

Please re-read my post.. I edited it after the original version.

[KaivaC]

You can still carry the left side, by high ilevel on the right, and doing this you still may be undergeared for the dungeon and straining your other 3 party members. SE seems to not understand this issue since it was never addressed.

I mean...at some point, the fault starts to lie with the players themselves. Even if one used a jump potion, you should have enough common knowledge about MMOs to know that you should keep your gear updated as you level up. The mistakes that the devs make, yes, they should be called at to fix. But if, as a player, you've made it to the second dungeon, and your right side is empty or is under 200 (I'm being very lenient on this...really, you should be at least 240-260 by the time you hit SB), then the fault lies entirely with that player doing this.

[Magic-Mal]

The problem is we, as a community, permit people in terrible gear because it's "mean" to kick someone with a level 50 weapon in Mettle or the autoattacking black mage in Doma Castle.

It's our fault.

Exactly, it should be FFXIV that teaches the players the most basic things. The game's only attempt at teaching anything is Hall of Novice and it only teaches extremely basic group dungeon mechanics. It doesn't go into anything about the stat weights for STR or DEX, it doesn't tell you about the best materia for your class/job, it doesn't tell you about healing/Regen aggro, it doesn't even help with a single mechanic to be found in the game. Not even in the slightest. FFXIV teaches the player absolutely nothing. I blame not only the player, but FFXIV for it's lack of teaching of the actual game. And no the Novice Network and random 500 person FCs aren't an excuse for the devs to be lazy about it.

And if people are never told what's wrong by the players early on in the game, they can easily never realize it until many dungeons later.

[AmeliaVerves]

I mean...at some point, the fault starts to lie with the players themselves. Even if one used a jump potion, you should have enough common knowledge about MMOs to know that you should keep your gear updated as you level up. The mistakes that the devs make, yes, they should be called at to fix. But if, as a player, you've made it to the second dungeon, and your right side is empty or is under 200 (I'm being very lenient on this...really, you should be at least 240-260 by the time you hit SB), then the fault lies entirely with that player doing this.

Thank you!
I am wondering all the time how gated this game needs to be for some people. All of us started the same way and back in ARR and early HW there were many more things you had to figure out by educated guess work or help from your mates and fc. ö.ö It's not like this game includes any rocket science or anything.

Just tell the guy who is wearing wrong gear what is wrong and if they didn't know but react properly go on. If they bitch about it just kick them. Easy as that... Not to mention that it is rather irritating people don't bother to read the tooltips of their stats, but well if they just started the game I guess it's ok to explain stuff to them.

[Reynhart]

The problem is we, as a community, permit people in terrible gear because it's "mean" to kick someone with a level 50 weapon in Mettle or the autoattacking black mage in Doma Castle.

Considering every content gets nerfed to the ground every time someone complains, I'd say the game itself is designed to give them a pass...