Any update on Gil for Crysta? [WOW Gold for Subscription Model in FFXIV]

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

You can't kill bots, but you can reduce their impact by removing a big chunk of their customers.

If i remember right, GW2 did this, and it was still cheaper to buy from bots.

[alimdia]

If i remember right, GW2 did this, and it was still cheaper to buy from bots.

Of course, bots are gonna adjust their prices to try to lure people, but many people would pay more if it means they can do it in a safe way, with no risk of ban and supporting SE all at the same time. Every dollar these people spend in RMT sites is money SE isn't getting, on top of the bots used to farm all that gil has a negative impact in the economy, on top of the stolen CC used to create those bot accounts that hit SE once they are chargebacked.

[RyuDragnier]

If i remember right, GW2 did this, and it was still cheaper to buy from bots.

People are still fools if they buy from bots in that game. It's ridiculously easy to make money in GW2.

[Emerald_Swords]

How is it faring for WOW players? Generally curious.

[Delmontyb]

How is it faring for WOW players? Generally curious.

First a lot of WOW players were worried that it would kill the markets, but that didn't happen, in fact, it's stronger than ever. Players who used to make a living off of selling in-game currency (a violation, rightfully so) are now out of business for the most part.

Some players even pay for other Battlenet games with gold, which is an interesting market for sure.

[giwaman]

Is this a troll post? No thnx!.

[KisaiTenshi]

Several years ago when WOW introduced their subscription token, Yoshi-P was asked about it for FFXIV. He said that they are watching how it works in WOW and would bring it over into FFXIV if ether players wanted it, or if it was successful.

It's been several years, and I think it's been a success, not just at giving Gil more of a reason for existing, but also in crushing RMT activities, and more. They might still exist, but not at the levels we see them in FFXIV and more.

The question is, is there any update on this from Yoshi-P? We already have a currency Crysta that can pay for our sub time, so it would be great if there was a way for the market to allow for this, and that crysta would be used for more things then just sub-time. I think the obvious hurdle is that you would need the store to be in the game, rather than just on the website.

Thanks!

Every version of just straight buying the in-game currency from the cash shop in MMO's has been an abject failure, and has instead just made the RMT problem worse. All it does it put a cap on the price the RMT can achieve. It doesn't get rid of them, and thus makes it difficult to track. Bots still comprise 50% of the "active" players in a zone at any point in time where new characters are permitted.

If you want to end RMT, by cash shop, lock the servers down, and instead make players buy access to servers. Servers that are full or nearing full, set the character creation price to the same price as a new copy of the game, and only permit additional characters by players who already have a character on that server. Servers that are basically empty, set the price to low, and cycle which under-utilized server is "free to create new/trial characters" every week, so that the damage RMT can do is minimized. The only time our servers are ever free of RMT is when they're too congested for them to create new throw-away characters on.

A better strategy would be to just make physical authenticators mandatory. Or perhaps make it mandatory for full and nearly-full servers.

[Elamys]

Every version of just straight buying the in-game currency from the cash shop in MMO's has been an abject failure

WoW token is far from an abject failure. It was so successful they now allow it to be used for other Battle.net purchases. I never encounter RMT bots anymore in that game. Nobody cares about them. Why buy gold from a sketchy bot when you can get thousands upon thousands through a legit method? The seller of a token is pretty much guaranteed for it to sell within an hour, while the buyer is given an option that's not real money to continue playing a game they like. My fiancee makes a lot of gold in WoW. It's been a huge relief that if there's a point where money is tight, he doesn't have to give up his favorite game, he can just drop the gold on a completely legitimate and safe purchase.

People were convinced that WoW tokens would be the death knell of the game, unleash pay to win on us all (actually they said that for the sparkle pony too, so I'm going to disregard that), and were the worst idea ever. They weren't. They got added in and absolutely nothing about how we interact with the game changed. The increase in prices on the auction house was because of the insane amount of gold someone was able to get passively from garrisons and class halls, not from people selling tokens.

Right now a North American WoW token is selling for 167k. That's a pretty sharp drop, but that's still a healthy amount for $20. I have no reference for what RMT is selling gold for on NA servers because I have literally never seen one since the token was added.

[KisaiTenshi]

WoW token is far from an abject failure. It was so successful they now allow it to be used for other Battle.net purchases.

Right, so the RMT players just buy the gold cheaper from the bots when the bots are cheaper, and thus they've bought their battle.net games at discount. That's a failure. It's a money laundering machine, whom Bizzard doesn't want to acknowledge (https://www.pcgamer.com/how-microtra...launder-money/ ).


I'll assume for the sake of argument that players aren't actually buying other games because they already have them, just cash shop consumables. So it's effectively P2W. I don't know what WoW's cash shop is like, because I've not played it, and it's likely I never will because of things like this.

Half of these attempts try to emulate EVE's Plex system (Archeage being one of them), and they've all failed at it, instead of ending RMT, it just caps the RMT's price. The developers have to have gold sinks in the game to drain off game money otherwise it just results in inflation, where the most valuable items take billions of money and the bots on the market send the value of materials through the floor, resulting in crafting becoming unprofitable. If you aren't selling the latest item from the patch, you're going to lose money. These other games completely fail to recognize how the game's PvP activity actually results in destruction of that money, hence there is a very large gold sink in the game that is inherent to how it's played. It's metaphorically a spreadsheet simulator. EVE is another game that I not played, because this P2W element was not attractive in the least.

Like I really have to say it again, games that have straight up put the game currency on the cash shop, have admitted that they are failing and are trying to squeeze the last bit of money out of players without adequate sinking of the game currency. That puts players without deep wallets at an extreme disadvantage against players whom can just buy their way into the end-game. Nearly everything in FFXIV other than crafting doesn't even need you to have any gil. You can finish the game, and compete in raids and PvP without ever buying anything.

[MomomiMomi]

Right, so the RMT players just buy the gold cheaper from the bots when the bots are cheaper, and thus they've bought their battle.net games at discount. That's a failure. It's a money laundering machine, whom Bizzard doesn't want to acknowledge (https://www.pcgamer.com/how-microtra...launder-money/ ).


I'll assume for the sake of argument that players aren't actually buying other games because they already have them, just cash shop consumables. So it's effectively P2W. I don't know what WoW's cash shop is like, because I've not played it, and it's likely I never will because of things like this.

Half of these attempts try to emulate EVE's Plex system (Archeage being one of them), and they've all failed at it, instead of ending RMT, it just caps the RMT's price. The developers have to have gold sinks in the game to drain off game money otherwise it just results in inflation, where the most valuable items take billions of money and the bots on the market send the value of materials through the floor, resulting in crafting becoming unprofitable. If you aren't selling the latest item from the patch, you're going to lose money. These other games completely fail to recognize how the game's PvP activity actually results in destruction of that money, hence there is a very large gold sink in the game that is inherent to how it's played. It's metaphorically a spreadsheet simulator. EVE is another game that I not played, because this P2W element was not attractive in the least.

Like I really have to say it again, games that have straight up put the game currency on the cash shop, have admitted that they are failing and are trying to squeeze the last bit of money out of players without adequate sinking of the game currency. That puts players without deep wallets at an extreme disadvantage against players whom can just buy their way into the end-game. Nearly everything in FFXIV other than crafting doesn't even need you to have any gil. You can finish the game, and compete in raids and PvP without ever buying anything.

You have shown a clear misunderstanding of the system, as there is no inflation. The gil is not for sale on the cash shop. It is received from another player. Gil is not created, it simply moves hands.

Furthermore, a gil cap on RMT trades is a win by any measure. It means you're cutting into their profits, no longer letting them have their monopoly of your (the developer) assets.


Some players may buy from the bots still, but you are completely ignoring all the players who will be willing to pay a higher price for a completely safe method of getting their gil. No risk of being scammed, and better yet, no risk of being banned.