Making Warrior's Butcher Block combo relevant

[Garry]

The real deal on more technical classes is that they tend to be lower dps, but higher utility. Meaning if you play bad it is less reflected in your personal dps and you have built in utility to fall back on even if your dps rotation is abit too difficult for you to pull off.

That said no job is all that hard.

[Lyth]

Butcher's Block has the most efficient trade-off of enmity for dps out of any of the tank enmity combos. It is the only enmity combo which gives you resources. Both PLD and DRK lose MP (and in the case of DRK, blood) for using their respective combos. Butcher's is also the only enmity combo which has a raw potency advantage (30 potency) over its dps combo prior to factoring in gauge. It has the highest baseline enmity out of the three combos by a significant margin.

The trade-off is essentially 10 gauge for 30 potency and a ton of enmity. Following the 4.2 WAR burst changes, the dps loss from Butcher's is smaller than ever, because none of your gauge usage factors into your free burst. When you factor in Unchained and your oGCD enmity tools, it's really hard to complain about enmity management on WAR. It has, by far, the least punishing enmity management of the three. It's what, a 42 potency loss at the worst? For a safety net combo that you should never really have to use because of all of your other enmity tools?

I can see why people may find enmity combos uninteresting or dislike that they take up hotbar space. I don't see the reasoning for specifically complaining about the most powerful enmity combo of the three, especially whilst expressing discontent over how simplified WAR has become in the same breath. It's difficult to not to see why it happened.

[Garry]

Well and so part of my point is it's not just butcher block it's all the emnity combos. I just described the one i am most familiar with being a warrior main, as to talk about any other class would make me look foolish.

From there if you really wanna compare as warrior is easy to pick on because it's on top. It actualy is alot closer to dark knight than you might think.


As 10 beast gage is worth about 100 potency worth of damage and the storms path combo vs the butchers block combo is about a 70 potency difference. more of a difference if your going into tank stanc even with unchained you still lose your free crit from beast gauge bar and you are losing out on your 5% increase in damage dealt, so it can be pretty signifigant. However assuming we stay in dps stance it's a straight trade of more emnity for 70potency damage loss.

Now comparing to dark knight which i dont know super well, but i read a guide and i am currently leveling mine. you also lose 70 pts for going the power slash route as the mana combo regens about half a dark arts worth of mana. So the loss is about the same. More so if you are switching to tank stance, but why would you waste GCD or in warriors case force yourself into tank stance for an extra GCD, and likely doing so might force you to lose a fel cleave or more likely over ca pgauge if it's an emergency.

SO all the emnity combos suck, and pulling hairs on which loses more is pretty besides the point.

THE POINT IS: the emnity combos are boring and pretty dumb, and all the tanks should have a more interesting and compeling reason to use this abilities.

[Ekimmak]

THE POINT IS: the emnity combos are boring and pretty dumb, and all the tanks should have a more interesting and compeling reason to use this abilities.

It's called "The White Mage is making up for Heartless Angel, shirk has already been used, and there's no Ninja."

[Lyth]

A Fell Cleave is not actually a 520 potency gain. Because it happens on the GCD, you gain 520 potency but also lose the potency value of the GCD of the GCD it replaces, as well as any resources that you would have gained from that GCD. As an example, if you replace Heavy Swing, the potency gain is

50 gauge = 520 - 160
50 gauge = 360
10 gauge = 72 potency

Butcher's block is unique in that it actually has more raw potency than Storm's Path. So you actually gain 30 potency for using it, but lose 10 gauge. That's where the 42 potency comes from. And that's the very worst case scenario. If you replace any other combo action with Fell Cleave, the value of Fell Cleave drops off because you're losing gauge and potency for it. If you truncate Storm's Path, for example, you have

50 gauge = 520 - 280 - 20 gauge
70 gauge = 240
10 gauge = 34 potency

So if that's the Fell Cleave we're talking about, then Butcher's Block ends up being a 4 potency loss.

I'm not specifically confused about what you wrote. I'm more confused about how this blossomed into a discussion on how difficult enmity management is on WAR of all things.

[whiskeybravo]

I'm not specifically confused about what you wrote. I'm more confused about how this blossomed into a discussion on how difficult enmity management is on WAR of all things.

I finally got to OT train a couple of times since unlock. Paired with a DRK so I just let him tank it. I was stealing aggro off of him by the time IR was over. Wasn't really a prob since I had shirk.. But I was like "damn, I thought DRK had a strong pull game". He was probably doing something wrong, still got a little chuckle out of it.

[Kabooa]

I finally got to OT train a couple of times since unlock. Paired with a DRK so I just let him tank it. I was stealing aggro off of him by the time IR was over. Wasn't really a prob since I had shirk.. But I was like "damn, I thought DRK had a strong pull game". He was probably doing something wrong, still got a little chuckle out of it.

It's only a strong pull game if you open in grit with DA Plunge and DA Powerslash.

"But muh deeps"

[Garry]

Teh strongest aggro is warrior period. The heal from equilbirium is so much stap aggro, along side an unchained tamhawk and dps stance IR, the other tanks can't really do that and still keep thier dps up.

[SleepyNeko]

I finally got to OT train a couple of times since unlock. Paired with a DRK so I just let him tank it. I was stealing aggro off of him by the time IR was over. Wasn't really a prob since I had shirk.. But I was like "damn, I thought DRK had a strong pull game". He was probably doing something wrong, still got a little chuckle out of it.

WAR has the best enmity on opening without sacrificing much dps, I would been more convenient for the DRK if you had MT pull the boss. Also there is no need to Shirk the DRK for train you can just take over as MT.

[whiskeybravo]

WAR has the best enmity on opening without sacrificing much dps, I would been more convenient for the DRK if you had MT pull the boss. Also there is no need to Shirk the DRK for train you can just take over as MT.

Nah, that's what DRK is for. Magic damage.