why does enochian exist for black mage

[zuzu-bq]

Lore-wise as the Warrior of Light you have the Echo of Word (among many others) and can communicate with creatures most people of Eorzea can't, and talk their language. Later on Polyglot reflects the mastery of languages. I think this a neat touch to Black Mage lore that had never really been explained in depth due to HW Job quests writting to lack on many places.

As for gameplay, Enochian only still exists as a button in form of a minor punishment for messing up the rotation in less than 30s of its use. On Heavensward it was a content button to be pressed during the rotation, every 60~75 seconds or so.

[Dualgunner]

So uh, you just didn't at all read my previous post did you?

[Dualgunner]

I guess my main point is, I'm a bit tired of the "RDM is braindead" meme. It's simplistic, but it does retain some nuances that are pretty clear in a party which RDMs understand and respect them, and which ones don't. Sorry for going offtopic.

[Zerathor]

Idk if there's really a topic anymore. Enochian is an easy mechanic. The fact that it's a cooldown instead of a trait should help whip new blm's into understanding they should never lose it. which I like because for many other jobs, more casual players can fall into a rut of doing their rotation horribly wrong but assume it's right because it flows. Blm only flows well when you're at least 80% correct on it.

That's my opinion on it. It could easily be made into a trait that just auto applies when you enter AF/UI, but at the end of the day it only saves one ogcd clip, and saves one keybind on a job that needs very few key binds in comparison to competing dps jobs. Which to me at least is a total non-issue compared to fixing other issues. Like freeze/b2 being useless, and f2 becoming useless at 70.

[Dualgunner]

So your argument is that you can't optimize very much because it's an 8 button rotation, with two number gauges to track and oGCDs that are just pure damage. Fair enough. Now let's be intellectually honest and keep it about RDM optimization instead of trying to shift this over to "RDM vs other jobs."

You have 8 buttons. Your gauge grows in increments of 3/3, 4/4, 9/0, 0/9, 11/0, 0/11, 21/0, and 0/21, as well as an ability to double your current resource. You want to get to 80/80+, but not overcap at 100/100. You want to line your burst up with a minute-to-minute burst as best as you can, but your burst will happen roughly every 40 seconds; you also have to take into account the idea that RNG will decide your mana generation pace to a degree, so it will be rare that any two instances will be the same (ie, you won't always be on the same GCD at the same time every fight, like, say, Samurai).

You also have to take into account your entire mana generation plan will be off if you have to raise at any point. You also need to know in advance if there are any points where you can't be in melee; if you have to leave and know you'll overcap if you do, you burn some mana into E. Riposte before moving out.

Not to mention displacement optimization, which you conveniently leave out, which is a very dangerous optimization to do while learning it because it can put you into walls or mechanics, or leave you out of range of healing. It remains a 130 potency attack, however, that has a 35 second cooldown that gets refreshed when manafication is used; just ignoring it is a lot of damage lost. Same with Corp-a-Corps, but that's much less dangerous in most situations.

Does RDM have a simple rotation? It's not overly complex, no. It flows well, for sure. I really like what Zerathor said though; it flowing well can lead many to think they're doing well when they're not. And there's definitely a lot of room to optimize with "8 buttons".

[Ryallen]

So your argument is that you can't optimize very much because it's an 8 button rotation, with two number gauges to track and oGCDs that are just pure damage. Fair enough. Now let's be intellectually honest and keep it about RDM optimization instead of trying to shift this over to "RDM vs other jobs."

You have 8 buttons. Your gauge grows in increments of 3/3, 4/4, 9/0, 0/9, 11/0, 0/11, 21/0, and 0/21, as well as an ability to double your current resource. You want to get to 80/80+, but not overcap at 100/100. You want to line your burst up with a minute-to-minute burst as best as you can, but your burst will happen roughly every 40 seconds; you also have to take into account the idea that RNG will decide your mana generation pace to a degree, so it will be rare that any two instances will be the same (ie, you won't always be on the same GCD at the same time every fight, like, say, Samurai).

You also have to take into account your entire mana generation plan will be off if you have to raise at any point. You also need to know in advance if there are any points where you can't be in melee; if you have to leave and know you'll overcap if you do, you burn some mana into E. Riposte before moving out.

Not to mention displacement optimization, which you conveniently leave out, which is a very dangerous optimization to do while learning it because it can put you into walls or mechanics, or leave you out of range of healing. It remains a 130 potency attack, however, that has a 35 second cooldown that gets refreshed when manafication is used; just ignoring it is a lot of damage lost. Same with Corp-a-Corps, but that's much less dangerous in most situations.

Does RDM have a simple rotation? It's not overly complex, no. It flows well, for sure. I really like what Zerathor said though; it flowing well can lead many to think they're doing well when they're not. And there's definitely a lot of room to optimize with "8 buttons".

That's a lot of words just for "keep the numbers balanced and know when to use them." Just because you *can* think about RDM's rotation in minute detail doesn't mean you *have* to. You can make literally any class complicated by thinking about it on a millisecond by millisecond basis. RDM's rotation is still one of the easiest in the game to manage because all you really have to look for is what procs you have up and what numbers are higher and lower. And knowing when to use your gap closer and opener, along with Manafication and Embolden, is all stuff other classes have to think about as well, especially melee classes. Except most of them don't have the luxury of being able to back up out of danger at will. What RDM has to manage is no more complicated than any other class has to manage, especially seeing as the only buff RDM would be able to contribute to a raid wide DPS burst is Embolden.

[Dualgunner]

That's a lot of words just for "keep the numbers balanced and know when to use them." Just because you *can* think about RDM's rotation in minute detail doesn't mean you *have* to. You can make literally any class complicated by thinking about it on a millisecond by millisecond basis.

Yes. That's called "optimization." It's distinctly what you said wasn't plausible for RDM. Humorously enough, you can also make any job sound simple when you boil it down to single sentences like that. And do recall I said this discussion is about your claim:

It's really hard to optimize a class where your main rotation consists of eight buttons and only one ability you possess alters your rotation or your function in any way. (Acceleration in this case.)

And not, in fact, about RDM versus any other job.

[Ryallen]

Yes. That's called "optimization." It's distinctly what you said wasn't plausible for RDM. Humorously enough, you can also make any job sound simple when you boil it down to single sentences like that. And do recall I said this discussion is about your claim:


And not, in fact, about RDM versus any other job.

What I said as a throwaway line meant to express the fact that RDM is the class with the lowest skill floor of all the classes in FFXIV and, compared to every other class in the game, is not as hard to manage as others in a raid tier. I did *not* say that RDM was impossible, just very hard. The fact remains that RDM *does* in fact have a very easy rotation to learn and two very easy to understand numbers to keep track of as opposed to most other classes which have several of each to manage, not including the abilities that require actual thought to perform correctly such as Ninja's mudras. Optimizing RDM isn't any more difficult than optimizing any other in the game at a raiding level.

Since someone wants to repeat themselves and double down rather than thinking or taking advice from people more experienced than they are I'll just giggle at this.

Tell me about how I can go ranged at-will when I start meleeing Kefka assuming there will be a safe spot near him only to see everything is wrong and I'm screwed. Few jobs suffer from disengaging at a poor time like RDM does.

I already said that what RDM has to manage isn't any more complicated than what any other class has to manage. Of course RDM loses DPS if they melee when the boss disappears to do whatever they're gonna do. But any class loses DPS if they pop a big combo, attack, or buff at the right time, the only difference is that RDM only has the melee combo and Embolden to lose. If you have the choice to take an AoE hit from God Kefka while attempting to finish your melee combo or backing out then running back in, which would you choose? Because if you're worried about your DPS I'd say dying is a much harder hit to your DPS than not being able to connect with your melee combo. BLM has it worse because if they don't have Triplecast up and accidentally places their Ley Lines poorly then BLM is out their faster cast time for 90 seconds, as opposed to RDM's less than 35 second timer to get their melee combo back.

[MoroMurasaki]

Except most of them don't have the luxury of being able to back up out of danger at will.

Since someone wants to repeat themselves and double down rather than thinking or taking advice from people more experienced than they are I'll just giggle at this.

Tell me about how I can go ranged at-will when I start meleeing Kefka assuming there will be a safe spot near him only to see everything is wrong and I'm screwed. Few jobs suffer from disengaging at a poor time like RDM does.