What if we got the Sub-Job System in FFXIV?

[Kaminto]

I am against the subjob system basically because it's nothing more than a numbers game, once someone finds and posts the optimal combinations it's "limitless diversity and range" are gone and players doing odd combinations will be ousted, it was a big thing in ffxi that caused those curious players doing whm/war to be seen as abominations and failures thus not getting into any parties.

[Sebazy]

I am against the subjob system basically because it's nothing more than your a numbers game, once someone finds and posts the optimal combinations it's "limitless diversity and range" are gone and players doing odd combinations will be ousted, it was a big thing in ffxi that caused those curious players doing whm/war to be seen as abominations and failures thus not getting into any parties.

I think that's short changing the system a little really.

Aside from a few very niche situations, WHM/WAR was an abomination in terms of the overwhelming majority of group play situations going. However I frequently went with a crazy melee Subjob to get Dancing Edge on BRD when farming to help my kill rate along (I think it was War as well tbh?). In actual group play, subbing RDM, BLM, SMN, SCH and occasionally even BRD were all very viable options back when I played. I ensured I had all options open to me and routinely made good use of all of them depending on the content and my group.

Some combinations were frowned upon not because they weren't meta, but because they were legitimately pointless and usually indicated that that player was going to be a detriment to the party. A WHM standing there meleeing in a merit, HNM or exp situation isn't remotely positive and can actually be a problem if they are actually even landing hits in the first place. Not to mention, a WHM that wasn't willing to have a useful sub levelled was also very likely to be problematic in other ways. I'm sorry if you disagree, but that's just how it was.

I do however agree that the subjob system should be approached cautiously. This isn't really a game that offers anything like the variety of combat situations that FFXI had and thus oddball subjob combinations will indeed be devalued as a result meaning the 'meta' is more likely to be rather rigid here than it was in FFXI.

[Shurrikhan]

I am against the subjob system basically because it's nothing more than a numbers game, once someone finds and posts the optimal combinations it's "limitless diversity and range" are gone and players doing odd combinations will be ousted, it was a big thing in ffxi that caused those curious players doing whm/war to be seen as abominations and failures thus not getting into any parties.

Isn't that what jobs themselves are? Not to mention stats? And any semblance of rotational choice (over varying SkS or SpS breakpoints)?

If optimization is the doom of customization, then we are already doomed, with only Refresh and the Limit Break gauge speed gimmick protecting even half the jobs.

[Kazrah]

Isn't that what jobs themselves are? Not to mention stats? And any semblance of rotational choice (over varying SkS or SpS breakpoints)?

It's nowhere near as much of a burden to the overall playerbase compared to implementing a sub-job system, as the advanced number crunching is only really a case of tryhards attempting to assert dominance. Does it help? Of course it does, but is it absolutely necessary to every aspect of PvE content? Not really, or else all content would be on par to savage.

It also brings about the argument of complexity: as long as types of players like ice mages still exist, why demand more complex gameplay elements when the current complexity of the game still confuses some players to this day?