Character Creation Has A Race Problem

[Magic-Mal]

I read it. All the way up to the recent shenanigans noting skin undertones and their potential combinations with racially specific features.

I still believe this is remarkably stupid.

It's like people don't understand it's a fictional universe with completely different biology.

But it's not different. Seems to me black people are in the game. Just like the real world.

[MoroMurasaki]

But it's not different. Seems to me black people are in the game. Just like the real world.

Ignoring the fact that most of those screenshots look like Caucasian people with darker skin... how does that matter? I'm not saying people should be avoiding using the available skin tones, I'm saying that what is available is what exists in Eorzea. The fact that there isn't the same bredth of racial diversity amongst Hyur as there is in humans isn't a "race problem" it's just a simple fact.

Hyur are not human. They don't need the same diversity that we see in real life. I mean honestly there are between 4 and 6 face options depending on what race and gender you choose to begin with, why is anyone focusing on anything as small as skin tones? There clearly isn't enough options within character creation to represent human diversity.

Good thing, again, the game doesn't have humans in it.

You love riding the high horse but I'm here to bring you down from that.
You know what most fantasy is based on? Real life. Just because The only way FF isn't based on real life is if everything looked like a Lupin and the like, but they do not.


I could make the same excuse for anything I disagree with like bigger butts and claim that it's fantasy and not reality so it shouldn't be suggested.
All of your sentences start with I this I that, notice the pattern?

My sentences start with I because I'm expressing my opinions and not trying to represent what anyone else thinks.

As to your "based in reality" idea... I main WHM in game. I can cast healing magics, conjure wind and stones out of thin air and literally raise the dead but sure the basis in reality is strong here. Lol.

What is the harm of requesting that some more ethnic options to the faces/features? Obviously SE has an idea of what they're going for with their characters, but requesting something never hurts.

While not everyone feels this way, there are some that appreciate being able to make a character that resembles them in some tiny way. Personally, I'm always a bit disappointed when I have to slog through a game as a male character. Should it matter? Probably not, but that feeling will crop up every time.

I would have no issue if this request was framed as "boy I sure do wish we had more diverse character creation options, anything to add some more differences would be great. Maybe they could incorporate things like Asiatic/African features into some facial options to switch things up."

The problem is the OP and subsequently plenty of people here have framed this as some kind of racial issue (I mean look at the title of the thread) when it just isn't. Hyur are not human. They do not inherently need to represent the full scope of human diversity and to expect them to is, in my opinion, stupid.

[Magic-Mal]

Ignoring the fact that most of those screenshots look like Caucasian people with darker skin... how does that matter?

1. They look black to me. Either exactly black or decidedly black by a clear attempt by SE to portray them such.

2. It matters because they exist and are sporting the limited hairstyles/features that can fit in a black character's design this disproving that there are no black people. I don't care if they're not African. Much like the majority of Far Eastern NPCs, they clearly represent Asians in every way besides certain game limitations like faces. SE happily added Asian hairstyles all throughout Stormblood so there you have it. When they put resources into a character design, you get Hien. A visibly Asian guy.

Also...


How in the world do you say this:

I would have no issue if this request was framed as "boy I sure do wish we had more diverse character creation options, anything to add some more differences would be great. Maybe they could incorporate things like Asiatic/African features into some facial options to switch things up."

Then say this:

Hyur are not human. They don't need the same diversity that we see in real life.

Hyur are not human. They do not inherently need to represent the full scope of human diversity and to expect them to is, in my opinion, stupid.

Within the same post? They go completely against each other. If they aren't human, how can you be okay with asking for Asian or African features when Asians and Africans are human and therefore, by your logic, can't be compared to Hyurs?

[MoroMurasaki]

How in the world do you say this:


Then say this:


Within the same post? They go completely against each other. If they aren't human, how can you be okay with asking for Asian or African features when Asians and Africans are human and therefore, by your logic, can't be compared to Hyurs?

Saying those things go against each other would be like saying the sentiments "Miqo aren't cats" and "They could add some more ear/tail designs for Miqo inspired by real cats like calico or striped patterns" go against each other.

There is nothing wrong with the people of Doma and Hingashi appearing Asian just like there would be nothing wrong with another group of people Hyur (or another ingame race) looking decidedly African or the majority of Hyur currently appearing white/European. The issue is when people say "We have X from the real world represented so we also need Y and Z".

To me the entire racial argument outlined in this thread could just as easily be applied to Miqote. We have cat people based on cats, why not dog people based on dogs? And rabbit people, and fish people and bird people and plant people and so on and so on because if it exists irl it should be mushed with a human and made a playable race. It's only fair because Miqote exist.

That's a stupid argument because Miqote actually exist in Eorzea and dog versions of them don't just like the currently available skin tones and facial featured exist but apparently the OP's specific undertone does not.

I don't see what is so hard to grasp here.

1. I don't think you know what Fantasy based on reality means; hint, Othard/Hingashi isn't asian themed area out of coincidence.
2. You keep proving my point, you can't breathe unless you make sure that no idea that isn't your own is given consideration

I'm sorry I'm not arguing for your opinions, you're right! I should definitely spend my time making sure your voice is heard.

Or I could be a logical person and continue to express my own thoughts and feelings.

Seriously, what do you want? Is it not okay to poke holes in an idea online anymore? Its a forum to discuss things, dissenting opinions happen. Move on. You're now just complaining I disagree with a thing you like. Congrats, noted, it is clear. Maybe offer real counterpoints other than "omg you keep talking about what you think, wahhhhh" and I'll care about what you have to say.

[Magic-Mal]

I don't see what is so hard to grasp here.

Simply put, what's hard to grasp is why it's so hard for you to grasp why simple things like a haircut goes against the game world or that the game doesn't need it.

There is nothing wrong with the people of Doma and Hingashi appearing Asian just like there would be nothing wrong with another group of people Hyur (or another ingame race) looking decidedly African or the majority of Hyur currently appearing white/European.

Then what the heck is the problem then? I'm not OP. I'm not apart of the race war thing going on. I'm talking to you. If there are black and/or decidedly black/African character already in the game why are black-inspired hairstyles from the real world not needed? We already have Asian hairstyles and glamour, I don't understand. No one even said we needed it it. Just asked for it.

Saying those things go against each other would be like saying the sentiments "Miqo aren't cats" and "They could add some more ear/tail designs for Miqo inspired by real cats like calico or striped patterns" go against each other.

Miqo'tes aren't cats though. Even the game denies it. And can you find a Miqo'te IRL? Probably not. Can you find a Hyur IRL with a moustache and ponytail wearing a leather jacket? You sure can.

EDIT: Heck even then that's not the point. Because Miqo'te already have lion tails as an option so it WOULDN'T be crazy to ask for more cat tails

[MoroMurasaki]

Snipped, on mobile sorry

I don't think you're coming at this from the angle to which I am opposed and maybe we got off on the wrong foot.

I don't think additional character creation options are stupid I think saying they should be there because those options exist in humans is stupid. Most races have 4 preset faces and slender builds, do you really think that the entire wealth of human diversity can be expressed by such a character creation engine?

My issue is with many posters in this thread seeming to feel entitled that their specific skin tone or the skin tone they desire is not available, as if Hyur need every possible skin tone that exists in humanity. They have further gone on to imply that SE is somehow being "racially insensitive" by lacking these options in a fantasy videogame.

I maintain that Hyur are not humans. Humans can't do magic for starters. We don't live in Eorzea. We aren't all shaped the same. There are tons of differences between Hyur and humamity. Some Hyur look like some humans but most humans don't resemble Hyur.

If you just want some more character creation options by all means make your own thread and I will support it 100%. If you want to attempt to guilt SE into including racially specific character creation options with bait titles about "race problems" though.... no, I will call out how wrong that is every time.

ugh

Keep wasting your daily post count complaining about how you don't like me for reasons you can't articulate. Anything to keep you from spreading this sort of nonsense elsewhere

[Ghastly]

I like this thread though, it shows a lot of things which needed to be seen.
As for the idea itself, I fully support it, Square Enix should to take this into consideration when/if they expand the character creator.

.

The message keeps flying over your head, your high horse fell over there.

[Ghastly]

.

1. I don't think you know what Fantasy based on reality means; hint, Othard/Hingashi isn't asian themed area out of coincidence.
2. You keep proving my point, you can't breathe unless you make sure that no idea that isn't your own is given consideration