How Do You Feel When Old Content Is Made Easier?

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

It's clear you have never stepped foot in savage if you think it's easy to carry people through it. This must be why people still struggle clearing Alexander savage fights, even unsynced. It's too easy.

[Fawkes]

Some content gets harder over time naturally, because all the best players finish it and then never go back.

It annoyed me in FFXI how everyone simultaneously praised CoP and also completely swore off ever going back and doing any of the fights again.

[Brightamethyst]

It annoyed me in FFXI how everyone simultaneously praised CoP and also completely swore off ever going back and doing any of the fights again.

Running for my life through that mine and that final battle with a balrog was awesome and exhilarating. I can't wait to do it again! - Gandalf

[RiyahArp]

It annoyed me in FFXI how everyone simultaneously praised CoP and also completely swore off ever going back and doing any of the fights again.

COP was too hard, period. I think i bowed out at the airship fight, but people mostly praised the story; the challenge was just too much and the expansion after was much less difficult overall I think because of it. It's pretty much the best argument for not making story content hard, because players just never beat the COP story unless they were diehard endgamers who needed sea access. They didn't get better, they just got filtered out.

As for keeping old difficulty, people say they want hard stuff, but leave after the first wipe. FFXI had hard stuff, but they also had easier stuff or different stuff as an alternative. Here there really isn't alternatives to story mode or endgame mode. So if you make it hard, people are going to get roadblocked and have nowhere else to go.

[Brightamethyst]

COP was too hard, period. I think i bowed out at the airship fight, but people mostly praised the story.

To be fair, that airship fight was WAY overtuned. Many CoP fights were hard, but 6-4 was insane even compared to the rest.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

As for keeping old difficulty, people say they want hard stuff, but leave after the first wipe. FFXI had hard stuff, but they also had easier stuff or different stuff as an alternative. Here there really isn't alternatives to story mode or endgame mode. So if you make it hard, people are going to get roadblocked and have nowhere else to go.

That isn't necessarily true. Generally speaking, people asking for casual content to be more difficult are not looking for something which will stomp their face in, but something that actually requires a pulse. Right now the overwhelming majority of content scarcely demands more than you to be awake, which is why when sudden difficulty spikes do occur, it throws people for a loop. I know you love arguing to the contrary, however I think it's pretty telling when a friend and I purposely only healed Phantom Train normal and I literally could have AFK'd to make a sandwich. I was that useless. Somehow, I think we can have difficulty above that without going overboard.

[Vidu]

That isn't necessarily true. Generally speaking, people asking for casual content to be more difficult are not looking for something which will stomp their face in, but something that actually requires a pulse. Right now the overwhelming majority of content scarcely demands more than you to be awake, which is why when sudden difficulty spikes do occur, it throws people for a loop. I know you love arguing to the contrary, however I think it's pretty telling when a friend and I purposely only healed Phantom Train normal and I literally could have AFK'd to make a sandwich. I was that useless. Somehow, I think we can have difficulty above that without going overboard.

To second that:
Some content doesnt even need you to be awake, depending on your role...
When I'm really tired, I run content on my scholar. I've literally fallen asleep for 10-30 seconds during runs and it didnt matter in the slightest.

Once I "healed" a Halatali NM run for friends, again as scholar. I was afk for the whole thing except for the parts when you have to interact with the "teleporters". My fairy did quite fine by herself - and sure, I could have cast dps-spells and I usually do, but thats not so much better.
I went through Gubal NM earlier - throwing out one Adlo before each pull and then letting the fairy do her thing was enough, while I was spamming Broil...
Thats not hard stuff - thats braindead easy stuff.

[RiyahArp]

That isn't necessarily true. Generally speaking, people asking for casual content to be more difficult are not looking for something which will stomp their face in, but something that actually requires a pulse.

Some people's "requires a pulse" is others "stomp your face in." remember, the endgame crowd thinks byakko ex is incredibly easy. Increasngly they thnk only the last two turns and utlimate are the only "hard" content in this game.

The dungeons are fine. They are easy, yes, but that means I can go in with a job i am rusty at to practice my full 70 kit again without worrying i will wipe the run.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Some people's "requires a pulse" is others "stomp your face in." remember, the endgame crowd thinks byakko ex is incredibly easy. Increasngly they thnk only the last two turns and utlimate are the only "hard" content in this game.

The dungeons are fine. They are easy, yes, but that means I can go in with a job i am rusty at to practice my full 70 kit again without worrying i will wipe the run.

Name me one current dungeon that is even remotely challenging. I have ran Swallow's Compass, the most recent dungeon, with multiple people of varying skill and the healing requirements are so laughably low most of them spent 90% of the run DPSing. As for Byakko EX. He is easy. Just because players are bad doesn't change that fact. Speaking from my own experience, I cleared him after three pulls on a job outside my main (Warrior) having only a vague idea of his mechanics. And I was at ilvl. All it took was learning placements and listening to advice from the friends I ran it with. Anyone can do that. In fact, I have been teaching an "uptime" strat for Tsukiyomi. The only time it's ever been an issue is when people refuse to listen or learn from their mistakes.

You can literally spam 1-2-3 and clear every single dungeon in the game. If I don't do wall to wall pulls, I may as well remove all my tank CDs. They are functionally useless. Likewise, I am basically a glorified DPS on healers unless the tanks do super pulls. Even a good chunk of big pulls aren't all that difficult if you're remotely decent.

This sentiment, by the way, is not simply my own. It's shared amongst casual raiders. NEST of all groups mocked the lackluster challenge of Alte Roite and meme'd on Phantom Train. Both may be harder than actually else the game offers but they aren't difficult per se. They're fun fights, I will grant you that, but not overly difficult.

[Deceptus]

Some people's "requires a pulse" is others "stomp your face in." remember, the endgame crowd thinks byakko ex is incredibly easy.

I am by no stretch of the words an end game person (I've never touched a single savage other than coil unsynced at 70) and I was able to go into BEX and clear it easily at min ilvl. Byakko is basically do the mechanics (which are one at a time, and easy to recognize), don't die, and you'll clear.

I come at this from a healer's perspective. My whole job is to fix people's screw ups and there is a large majority of the player base who screw up. A lot.