Duty Recorder Forgotten?

[Magic-Mal]

Ignoring all of the ither issues I have with your statememt I just want to know what sort if rewards world make raiding worth it for you?

I'm not the one you asked this to but there are things I'd definitely take.

• Weapon Glamours
• Armor Glamours
• Mounts
• Minions
• Furniture
• Music

Basically non-gear items, themed to the raid and bosses of course. Items that aren't thrown away last because of item level. If those kinds of things were added I'd probably have more interest. Like the Field Commander boots from Seal Rock. I tried extra hard just to get those lol.

No matter how long of a break I take, the boots will still be here waiting for me while raid gear would be trash!

[Remedi]

Say what if you could improve geat like wow but using crystals like the eureka ones to improve the gear?No rng on it and it only depends if you want to do it

Like 24 man gear upgreadable this way, could be interesting maybe or heck even dungeon gear

This can be applied to all the gear in the game with the catch of the upgrade becoming more and more expensive as it progresses.

Also they could make that you can do things like adding materia slots to armor and weapons by exchanging some tokens (like the world bosses one for example).

Honestly we kinda have the foundation to do that too they only need to make it real

[Dzian]

Ignoring all of the ither issues I have with your statememt I just want to know what sort if rewards world make raiding worth it for you?

As I and many others have said many times. People want rewards that feel valuable and worth something and wont just be tossed the next patch.. Even If you take 370 savage gear what really is it useful or needed for? Everything in the game can be easily smashed with gear 20-30 item levels lower than that.. So you don't need that gear for anything current. And it will be trash when 4.4 lands and people can just buy or craft 380 stuff. Or get it from the normal raids. Thus the gear has no purpose or value.. Which is why these topics keep coming up

Implementing horizontal progression is not going to abruptly make people care more about Savage if they aren't inclined to partake in difficult content to begin with. Likewise, horizontal progression is largely the illusion of choice. Say they offered five DRG sets, all i370. Theorycrafters will determine which set is mathematically superior and that set becomes the only one people care about. I mean, look at what we have now even with our basic stats. Very rarely do you see a Skill Speed DRG build because it's generally weaker, thus people aren't interested.

In itself no. But you could be pretty certain that if the rewards from said contents were better and more valuable then more people would be more inclined to try. As said before what you get out has to be worth what you put in. Where as now its common to see people say they just wait till they can unsync something or massively over power it because the rewards arent worth doing it now or when it's current.
Do not later when the lower effort required is more inline with the rewards value.

Regarding gear though. It may be true you don't see many dedicated skill speed builds or something but its equally true that many people just don't care for the stats in general.
"Oh my current body is 350 this one is 360 I'll buy and equip it."
What the stats are isn't even considered because I level is the only one that really matters. No one's cares if the 350 body had crit and the 360 has skill speed instead. All they look at is the item level Another reason why gear is cheap , dull and most players still never really invest and meld it.

Compare it to say glamour. Where people will often spend tens of millions of gil on a glamour item or 30 million gil on a pegasus whistle because it's worth something to them. But spend 100k on materia to improve there stats on there gear. No chance. Waste of money.... which is why people often say glamour is the endgame. Because it's the only thing that has any form of value.

Which is why quite a few players will put significantly more effort into getting a glamour piece than they will getting one that is actually an upgrade..

[MoroMurasaki]

As I and many others have said many times. People want rewards that feel valuable and worth something and wont just be tossed the next patch.. Even If you take 370 savage gear what really is it useful or needed for? Everything in the game can be easily smashed with gear 20-30 item levels lower than that.. So you don't need that gear for anything current. And it will be trash when 4.4 lands and people can just buy or craft 380 stuff. Or get it from the normal raids. Thus the gear has no purpose or value.. Which is why these topics keep coming up...

.... which is why people often say glamour is the endgame. Because it's the only thing that has any form of value.

Which is why quite a few players will put significantly more effort into getting a glamour piece than they will getting one that is actually an upgrade..

I'm confused - you never actually answered my question, just restated that you "and many others" feel like the ilvl bump from raid gear isn't worth it because it gets replaced. I get that, you've been a bit of a broken record about it, but I asked what would make it worth it to you.

Based on the part of your post responding to Cass I'm going to assume unique glamor items feel more "worth it" to you because you say it is "the only thing that has any form of value".

EX primals offer unique weapons you can't find elsewhere as well as items for crafting minions and housing items not to mention mounts, all of those are potential vanity items even though the weapons also have value as upgrades. Personally I will be using the Tsukuyomi rapier for a long time as glamour even after it outlives it's usefulness as a weapon.

Savage offers unique weapon and armor sets unobtainable by any other means as well as a mount upon completion of the last tier. While I don't find much of the sigma gear particularly exciting looking I know some people who do.

These items all serve a dual purpose of being unique in appearance and being an upgrade to stats... why are they excluded from your "glamour has value" statement?

I agree - the stats are useless, particularly to someone who doesn't specifically care about completing the content you need to do to get those stats to begin with. If the hardest thing you do is Ridorana of course you don't need 100 more Intelligence. To people who min max though? Or people who want to do as well as they possibly can? Yes, that matters.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Regarding gear though. It may be true you don't see many dedicated skill speed builds or something but its equally true that many people just don't care for the stats in general.
"Oh my current body is 350 this one is 360 I'll buy and equip it."
What the stats are isn't even considered because I level is the only one that really matters. No one's cares if the 350 body had crit and the 360 has skill speed instead. All they look at is the item level Another reason why gear is cheap , dull and most players still never really invest and meld it.

Compare it to say glamour. Where people will often spend tens of millions of gil on a glamour item or 30 million gil on a pegasus whistle because it's worth something to them. But spend 100k on materia to improve there stats on there gear. No chance. Waste of money.... which is why people often say glamour is the endgame. Because it's the only thing that has any form of value.

Which is why quite a few players will put significantly more effort into getting a glamour piece than they will getting one that is actually an upgrade..

If you actually raided or crafted, you would know how wrong such a sentiment is. Bard and Monk both use i350 pentamelded crafted accessories (Bracelet and Ring, respectively). Tank alternates i370 and i350. If you care anything about min/maxing, which plenty of raiders do, you absolutely care about those secondary stats because the whole idea is squeezing even more damage. Furthermore, the materia market is arguably the most consistent sale outside consumables. Looking at the Cactuar market, all three Direct Hit, Crit and Determination grade VI materia were bought until the page spilled over just this morning. If you think people wouldn't pay 100k, then you weren't paying attention before Cracked Crystals became commonplace. Even now, they routinely sell for 60-70k at the beginning of a tier, only to come down later on. Crafting and Gathering materia frequently sell for over 200-300k depending on the server.

People pay millions for glamour due to impatience and caring more about their character's appearance. The Ao Dai was once five million. Now? Not even one million anymore.

As Moro said above. If you care only about dungeons, of course nothing but ilvl matters. That content isn't intended to be anything except mindless chill. If you approach Savage, and care about improving as a player. You will care about your secondaries.

[Dzian]

I'm confused - you never actually answered my question, just restated that you "and many others" feel like the ilvl bump from raid gear isn't worth it because it gets replaced. I get that, you've been a bit of a broken record about it, but I asked what would make it worth it to you.

Sorry I thought I had answered. all I really want is for things to feel worth it.
How nice it'd be to get some stuff and know it won't be obsolet junk the instant a new patch lands.

How they'd do that I'm not to bothered about. I don't want xi style gear swaps or anything that extreme.

One quickly thought up way would be to drop the patch gear down a tier..
If for example 4.4 landed and the normal raid gear was 370 and the new crafted stuff was also 370, then straight away any 370 gear I have now will actually hold some value into the next patch instead of instantly being trash. My tomes of whatever they'd be could start working on 380 gear instead of 390. My normal raid drops could be used to gear classes still not in 370...

It's not perfect could probably use some tweaks but it's literally something I just thought up in like 2 minutes.. but it would increase the value and longevity of gear and ensure it is still relevant when the next patfh lands...

Would also allow players to keep multiple jobs geared to to higher standard rather all your gear being trash before you've even finished gearing 2 or 3 jobs..

All players really want is to not feel like everything they've done has been rendered worthless as soon as a new patch lands i think....

[Bourne_Endeavor]

One quickly thought up way would be to drop the patch gear down a tier..
If for example 4.4 landed and the normal raid gear was 370 and the new crafted stuff was also 370, then straight away any 370 gear I have now will actually hold some value into the next patch instead of instantly being trash. My tomes of whatever they'd be could start working on 380 gear instead of 390. My normal raid drops could be used to gear classes still not in 370...

And what reason do people have to even look at Normal mode then? I have multiple sets of i370, which means I'll do normal mode Omega once to unlock and never touch it again. Likewise, crafted gear markets completely die. No reason to purchase gear with an ilvl you already have or could easily acquire since Mendacity gear and upgrades will have no restrictions as it phases out Creation. The current system exists to incentivize both the aforementioned content. Without it, they both die.

[Vaer]

Would also allow players to keep multiple jobs geared to to higher standard rather all your gear being trash before you've even finished gearing 2 or 3 jobs..

How does it auto become trash if the new tome is locked? It is still useful if you want to do the normals or casual content. There is going to be a couple weeks where people doing savage are still going to be wearing old tier gear if they don't opt for crafted. A complete set of last tier gear gets you through the story and allows you to do all the new casual content (330-335) even 3-5 months later on any job you want. Even Rido is 335. I don't get the logic here.

If you make the new normal and crafted gear the same ilvl as last tier doesn't it automatically become trash per that definition? Normal would be dead really quick.

[Ameela]

Rewards this, rewards that...
I remember when games were about PLAYING them, who cares if the gear is trash if the fights themselves are still fun? Ultimate's rewards are worthless outside of vanity yet people still do the fight, I wonder why...

[HyoMinPark]

Rewards this, rewards that...
I remember when games were about PLAYING them, who cares if the gear is trash if the fights themselves are still fun? Ultimate's rewards are worthless outside of vanity yet people still do the fight, I wonder why...

Based on replies in other threads, Dzian wants the prestige attached to the items. When players can go back an expansion later and unsync for the same rewards, he feels the prestige is lost. In my opinion, it's all about materialistic value and status.

The only one who can devalue an accomplishment is oneself, and if anyone's achievements are devalued the minute someone gets it via "an easier way", then the achievement only mattered when one could hold it over the head of others in the first place. It wasn't about them having fun or proving to themselves "I can do this", and I disagree with pursuing things only so you can brag about "being better". I do harder content for the challenge and the fun, and when I clear, I've proven to myself that I can do it. Someone doing the fight two years later at 10 levels higher doesn't take that away, nor should it.

I'm not the one you asked this to but there are things I'd definitely take.

• Weapon Glamours
• Armor Glamours
• Mounts
• Minions
• Furniture
• Music

Basically non-gear items, themed to the raid and bosses of course. Items that aren't thrown away last because of item level. If those kinds of things were added I'd probably have more interest. Like the Field Commander boots from Seal Rock. I tried extra hard just to get those lol.

No matter how long of a break I take, the boots will still be here waiting for me while raid gear would be trash!

To be fair, Savage already has the glamours and the mounts (Coil has the music but Alexander's were made obtainable via story mode; minions were made available in both story mode and Savage). The stats on Midan gear are useless now, same with Coil or Alexandrian gear or even UCoB weapons, but people still use the pieces for Glamour. Unless you're meaning level 1 Glamour pieces...which, in my opinion wouldn't be much different than the actual gear. The NIN savage body for Sigmascape is hot garbage stat-wise, but gorgeous for glamour, so I know a several of my NIN friends/acquaintances that rolled on it just for Glamour.

And I believe Gordias dropped items that you could use for a few craftable housing items.