Dangerous Areas

[BreyVoreas93]

@HelSpites It’s also worth mentioning again that if you don’t like it don’t do it...very simple. I know this is going to come as a super shock to you but we don’t all think as you do and we sure as hell do not all want the same type of content....stuck to the same shit we have been doing for 5 years if that’s what you want.

[KisaiTenshi]

An open world dungeon would be a joke. The place would get zerged until everyone had had everything of value from it. The only way to avoid that would be to implement something to stop larger groups of players from going in all at once, but at that point why not just make the thing an instance?

You're not thinking big enough.

FFXIV V1.0 had a lot of these. We don't anymore precisely because you can zerg through them. In other games that have similar things, usually what happens is when the content is new, for about a week, you have people crowding to get into the content, but because there's so many people, it's simply not even remotely dangerous. After everyone has cleared whatever the goal is, it's abandoned and any players who try to play it as it was designed are left to their own devices unless people randomly pop in to it for something else like mining.

To a certain extent, Eureka functions this way. When there's too many people in it, the NM's are a push over. You can make it to Pazuzu's area at level 1, if you follow the train, or by waiting for mobs to turn the other direction. Where Eureka fails in this regard is that the mobs are still too dumb. A monster should see a level 1 player in a level 3 area and go "lunch!" and relentlessly go after them, but if the player runs into the level 5 area, the level 5 mob should go after the player AND the level 3 mob chasing them. A properly arranged set of AI would have monsters run away when they see they're out matched, and have groups of mobs gang up on groups of players, or NM's that spawn in their territory. Players just end up in the cross fire and have to defeat both.

[Azbroolah]

@HelSpites It’s also worth mentioning again that if you don’t like it don’t do it...very simple. I know this is going to come as a super shock to you but we don’t all think as you do and we sure as hell do not all want the same type of content....stuck to the same shit we have been doing for 5 years if that’s what you want.

Why did you ask for people's opinions if you don't want to hear anyone disagreeing with you?

[Skivvy]

I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me how a dangerous overworld is supposed to be fun, especially when coupled with the idea of some arbitrary punishment for death/failure (because reasons, I guess). Nothing I've ever experienced and nothing I've seen mentioned in this thread (or any thread of the same subject) has ever amounted to being anything more than a tedious speedbump or it can be easily trivialized in some way.

The only time a world is legitimately dangerous is when you're an ignorant newbie to the game's world (and probably to gaming in general). Once you've learned the basics of gaming and the basic rules of the game's world ("Haphazardly wandering too close to some mobs might make them attack me") and you stop shambling around like blind man in beer goggles, the idea of a dangerous world evaporates. Now instead of having a "dangerous" world, you just have something built to pad playtime and to arbitrarily punish carelessness or bad luck.

To take this to the extreme, why bother having anything aggro then in the open world in that case? As it is now, the most that generally happens is that you will have heavy cast on you as you run through a pack of mobs. Gatherers just need to cast stealth, and they're all good to go. Why bother with such a weak threat in the first place?

A tame overworld is just dull. However, with XIV, it's just part of a larger problem. There is very little reason to go out into the open world. If they actually added non-instanced dungeons, or some other content that kept it relevant, I could see it being worthwhile to make the open world tricky. I don't see XIV moving away from instanced dungeons, and everything being done through DF / PF, or quick easy ports. So for now, the overworld will just remain a fancy waiting room.

[BreyVoreas93]

Why did you ask for people's opinions if you don't want to hear anyone disagreeing with you?

There is a differenc in an opinion and trying to force yours down peoples throat. He has like 3 posts on here saying the same thing. It’s just negative, I totally respect disagreeing it’s trying to post it over an over to get people like minded.

[Magic-Mal]

Having a tedious world will never be worth it because no reward in this game will ever be worth the time going through that world. Simple.

For anything that's difficult or tedious, players will make guides or look up the answers anyway so they can trivialize everything. Look at Eureka. The so-called great dangerous place has been trivialized by the player-train where everything is burned down in a minute or less making the entire area pointless. Why? Because it's easier that way.

Anytime something is difficult, players will do anything in their power to make it easier or avoid it completely. It's a waste of time now.

[IttyBitty]

Something something combat system, something something class design, something something not designed for overworld content.

[Azbroolah]

There is a differenc in an opinion and trying to force yours down peoples throat. He has like 3 posts on here saying the same thing. It’s just negative, I totally respect disagreeing it’s trying to post it over an over to get people like minded.

I don't think he's being particularly aggressive or necessarily has bad points. It's absolutely a fair criticism that the kind of content you're requesting would probably not be very popular with a lot of the people that play this game, and I think he's just trying to point that out. I tend to agree with him -- this kind of content just doesn't seem like the kind of thing that would sit well in this game.

[BreyVoreas93]

I don't think he's being particularly aggressive or necessarily has bad points. It's absolutely a fair criticism that the kind of content you're requesting would probably not be very popular with a lot of the people that play this game, and I think he's just trying to point that out. I tend to agree with him -- this kind of content just doesn't seem like the kind of thing that would sit well in this game.

At the end of the day no one is wrong and I appreciate all the thoughts. I would personally engage in this type of content if done correctly.

[Lambdafish]

At the end of the day no one is wrong and I appreciate all the thoughts. I would personally engage in this type of content if done correctly.

Except thats not what is being debated. What is being debated is whether this kind of content is wanted by the playerbase, whether it would flow well with the rest of XIVs gameplay, and if its even a well designed, fun idea in the first place. I'd have to throw my hat in and say no to all 3.

As has been pointed out, a dangerous area would require consequence, which the open world of XIV does not provide on a core level. Secondly, what would be the point of the dangerous area? would have anything in it thats not in any other zone, in which case does it just become an inconvenience when I have been able to access it for 6 months? What about flying? What about gathering? These core gameplay elements don't mesh well with the idea. And finally, we already have a difficult zone in the game with challenging mobs, its called Eureka, and I think thats about the extent that the game should ever go, because an isolated instance can create its own rules rather than having to adhere to the rules of the overworld.

@HelSpites It’s also worth mentioning again that if you don’t like it don’t do it...very simple

Just FYI, this is an extremely poor way to pitch an idea. This isn't content in the game, its just content in your head (and not very fleshed out at that), meaning that people are entitled to disagree with its implementation.