Ultimate hiatus feedback

[Nestama]

I don't think Titan Hard Mode was nerfed, either. The only issue with that fight was that ARR had some sort of 3 second server tick, which when combo'd with being a foreigner on a server kilometres away from where you live, ALONG with playing on the PS3 meant you had to learn how to dodge mechanics before they even appeared (I still remember counting to 4 after every single cast-attack Titan did).

The only fights I can recall ever being nerfed at all are: Steps of Faith (which honestly had to happen. Some people are incapable of cooperating and that fight requires, at minimum, four people to handle the mechanics. Cannons and snares handled by two, adds handled by a tank and dragonkiller handled by one) and Second Coil of Bahamut - Turn 1-3 (4 was untouched, unless you count the Echo as a nerf). Amdapor Keep and Pharos Sirius were also nerfed... oh and Turn 5. That fight had some issues, though. Fun fact about Turn 2's ADS; a maintenance caused the enrage strat to be impossible (cast the enrage faster than healers can heal), but then SE 'fixed' the issue and allowed players to go back to enraging the boss.

That's about it, though. People demanded for Final Steps and Royal Menagerie to be nerfed, but SE never touched them (and now they're extremely easy because of ilevels).

[Aquaslash]

Actually, Weeping City was never nerfed. The others, yeah, but Weeping City was untouched. It only got “easier” because people outgeared it to the point where it was just throwing bodies at the bosses. Much like today’s 24-mans; they’re all wars of attrition at this point. Your overall point I do agree with though. Any sort of “hard” content is immediately met with calls for nerfs—especially if it’s MSQ-locked.

You're right about Weeping City. I think that was when they finally put their foot down and said "we're not nerfing this, get better"; then proceedes to have Dun Scaith frontload its difficulty on the first encounter and then focus on spectacle for the rest of the instance.

At any rate, let me throw my hat into the ring and agree with the masses here. I've become crazy casual now. After my static died in the middle of Exdeath prog, Chaos's PF was so unbelievably god awful that I took an extended hiatus from raiding altogether. I have not set foot in Savage this tier, I only just attempted and killed Byakko last week, and I have yet to even attempt Shinryu. Yet even I think that not doing a third Ultimate is a pretty big misstep, but I think a little more transparency is in order.

Who's getting burned out here? The Developers? The Japanese players? Cause it's clearly not the western players. Ultimate isn't for everyone, but everyone likes it anyway. Thanks to Twitch, people that aren't playing get to be a part of the action and that's huge. I have never seen such overwhelming positivity and good vibes in this game EVER, and I've been here since Second Coil. The Ultimate scene has the success that PvP WISHES it had (and won't ever have). I personally love the metagame class banter it's been generating and seeing things like DRK and RDM being in world first clears while WAR cleaves itself from the sidelines.

The effects are trickling down too. Swallows Compass is being run like it's Shisui. Disciples of the Hand and Land can make decent bank by supplying Ultimate players with consumables. Even I as a middling ALC specialist can get in on the action. I feel that to neglect something that for once is PROVEN to be successful in order to take a chance on some unknown isn't worth the risk. What if the new content ends up a farce like Diadem? Remember Coven weapons and how nobody liked them? Remember Lords of Verminion and how all of two people play it? If the new content is a flop then nobody's happy. Ultimate was killed for nothing and everyone unsubs after getting the latest Eureka glowstick.

Yet if its the DEVs that are burnt out, well we really need to know that. We know the team is spread thin, and can understand if they need to tap out. People will still leave in droves but at least they'll have proper closure and that can go a long way. If there are truly to be only two per expansion, they'll need to be spread out more.

What's gonna replace them though? Are we gonna get two dungeons on the odd patch to compensate? Another Trial? Surprise Raid Boss? Will Rathalos catch that many bodies? You can't just leave the hard core player base hanging like that. Ignore that guy who says they're being greedy, he's just gonna idle in Kugane's Reach like all the other 99%.

There's just so much good will and positive vibes here. Unless your devs are in desperate need of recharging, it'd be crazy to bow out now.

Zinnia Higana - Cactuar

[RiyahArp]

Ultimate isn't for everyone, but everyone likes it anyway.

No, everyone does not like it. No, we do not make money supplying for it, any ultimate static worth their salt has their own crafters to do it. We run swallows like shisui because the individual mobs barely have any HP. Seriously, slap some dots on the first wave of enemies you pull, see how much they go down. No, not everyone cares about twitch or streams, many people use those as a substitute for playing the game, same as e-sports in general. You're massively overstating the impact it has.

I mean, some of us tolerate it, but the ultimate patch for most people was wasted content, pushing HoH down the road because they didn't want ultimate people to have to choose between it and ultimate. If it disappeared, I wouldn't care in the slightest, and a lot of people wouldn't miss it either. So much garbage about its impact. Lol twitch streamers, twitch is a joke.

[Nestama]

I don't seem to recall SE stating they delayed HoH specifically for Ultimate players... also, I fully expected it to be in the .X5 patch cycle, as the same applied to Palace of the Dead (twice. 3.35 and 3.45).

Patches that end with .X1 (with the exception of .01) tend to only have fluff/quality of life stuff, or not exist at all (there's no 3.31, so what could have possibly 'delayed' Palace of the Dead?). 4.11 and 4.31 are the only .X1 patches to have a hardcore fight in them.

[HyoMinPark]

pushing HoH down the road because they didn't want ultimate people to have to choose between it and ultimate.

HoH wasn’t delayed because of Ultimate. The developers stated that it was delayed because the playerbase itself had a lot of content to do in Patch 4.3 proper—it had nothing to do with Ultimate or raiders.

[Remedi]

I'll say something terrible, but I'm starting to think that many ppl becoming like dsp and blame the game for their failings too much

[Emileigh]

No, everyone does not like it. No, we do not make money supplying for it, any ultimate static worth their salt has their own crafters to do it. We run swallows like shisui because the individual mobs barely have any HP. Seriously, slap some dots on the first wave of enemies you pull, see how much they go down. No, not everyone cares about twitch or streams, many people use those as a substitute for playing the game, same as e-sports in general. You're massively overstating the impact it has.

I mean, some of us tolerate it, but the ultimate patch for most people was wasted content, pushing HoH down the road because they didn't want ultimate people to have to choose between it and ultimate. If it disappeared, I wouldn't care in the slightest, and a lot of people wouldn't miss it either. So much garbage about its impact. Lol twitch streamers, twitch is a joke.

there are enough people who like it to make it greatly sucessful content. You do not represent the playerbase yourself. If you don't enjoy ultimate, fine say that. But the numbers of people replying in this thread, which have been overwhelmingly positive, say otherwise.

Also, the deyaled release schedule for eureka and heaven on high was stated because they wanted to give the players a chance to enjoy each new piece of content they add into the game without having to feel like you are rushed to complete it, or having to choose between a few different main pieces to do.

This problem is actually the same that we are complaining about. Where are there theoretical people claiming they need to slow down and stagger content to make sure we are completing each one thoroughly, completely, and without rush? I've never seen a claim for it. it makes the game feel stagnant and patches feel underwhelming.

[Aquaslash]

I mean, some of us tolerate it, but the ultimate patch for most people was wasted content

You sound like you're against Ultimate content entirely. Let me ask you then. What kind of content would YOU have for the hardcore raider playerbase?

This problem is actually the same that we are complaining about. Where are there theoretical people claiming they need to slow down and stagger content to make sure we are completing each one thoroughly, completely, and without rush? I've never seen a claim for it. it makes the game feel stagnant and patches feel underwhelming.

That is a general symptom of games like these. The playerbase consumes content far faster than the devs can make it. If you pump it all out at once there are people that will clear it within weeks if not days and then cry for more. Staggering the big bits is the right call

[Cidel]

HoH wasn’t delayed because of Ultimate. The developers stated that it was delayed because the playerbase itself had a lot of content to do in Patch 4.3 proper

Meh. I don't buy that. I'd say it was delayed because Tsukuyomi had the retention value of an ice cream sitting in the sun. If HoH was released alongside it, not nearly as much of the playerbase would have been running the trial, especially if they both offer the same ilvl weapons.

[Sunspawn]

tl;dr
100% agreed. I don't do Ultimate myself, but the few times I watched people progging it was entertaining enough even without trying it out myself.

Anything new from SE about it since the first post was made btw?