So about Summoner...

[RainDurell]

I think its kind of unfair that SMN is literally 2nd top dps, higher than all melee dps including the "selfish" utility-less SAM, while remaining almost fully mobile and with the ability to combat res.

To put it into perspective, SMN is only slightly behind BLM in terms of DPS, and they get to have far more mobility than BLM, which in turn makes BLM an unfavorable option for UwU, as SMN will most likely do more damage than BLM because they arent punished badly by the massive amount of movement mechanics in UwU.

Top that off with them having a combat res and a dps increase utility, they deal the highest damage out of every other job while providing amazing utility.

What I'm trying to say is, SMN does far too much damage on a single target for the amount of mobility and utility they bring.
Makes no sense to me why its okay for them to dish more damage than ALL other jobs, outside of BLM, which like I said will also probably be outdpsed in a fight as movement intensive as UwU

[Sunako]

Well if you check any singletarget fight like o6s
https://www.fflogs.com/statistics/21...=52&dataset=95
, samurai lead that pretty well. Summoner aoe damage is usually that what make you catch up other jobs and make it look it is doing more than anything else. Especially for UwU you can cheese lot damage hitting multiple plumes at same time. Most summoner aoe damage is ogcd so you can burst your aoe with deathflare, akh morn and painflare before anybody else have time to hit them that much. What makes you think blm can keep up with summoner while melee can not is because blm have really good burst aoe as well like triple flare, foul and aoe thunder.

[Zerathor]

It's all correct. They'll never make it ballanced though. Unfortunately we'll be stuck on smn for the rest of stormblood for any meaningful content.

[TelosNox]

It is very content specific.

O5 has the add phase and some relevant downtime phases for melee. That's why he is ahead there.

O6 has no downtime and no adds. You see: SMN is behind

O7 has adds and relevant downtime as well + lots of movement. That's why SMN is ahead but BLM is bad here (SAM is better)

O8 (Kefka) no adds and not so much movement BUT downtimes are favorable for SMN because they happen during cooldown phase. That's why he can keep up with SAM and BLM here

O8 (God) no adds, not so much movement, nearly no downtime. SAM and BLM are ahead, SMN is 3rd.

Yes SMN is in a good position for this raidtier. But is it really OP? Let there be more fights like O6 in the next raidtier and SMN will fall behind.

[Tex_Mex]

Unfortunately, it appears that your bias is getting the better of you at this point. Your comments read like you are just a BLM that believes they should be doing the most damage all the time because they aren't allowed to move. Both BLM and SMN are in really good places right now, so I feel like the devs time would be better spent helping out the heavily underperforming jobs (like RDM). Having one job just be better all the time is just bad design.

[RainDurell]

snip

RDM is in a bad spot, i agree, but that isn't the subject I'm talking about. And I completely agree that having one job being better all the time is bad, that's why I started this topic, SMN IS better most if not all the time, I'm not saying "buff blm", I'm saying that for the amount of utility and mobility smn have, they shouldn't be doing more damage than ALL melee dps. They should be somewhere on par with DRG/NIN, not above.

[Zerathor]

snip .

BLM is in a good spot atm, but for how minimal their gain is, (especially on certain fights) it's not spectacular enough to ignore a missing raise that smn brings. SMN is in a really BS strong place as THE meta caster.

Rdm could use some help though

[Tex_Mex]

RDM is in a bad spot, i agree, but that isn't the subject I'm talking about. And I completely agree that having one job being better all the time is bad, that's why I started this topic, SMN IS better most if not all the time, I'm not saying "buff blm", I'm saying that for the amount of utility and mobility smn have, they shouldn't be doing more damage than ALL melee dps. They should be somewhere on par with DRG/NIN, not above.

Im fairly certain that if you add on the rDPS contribution of NIN and DRG to their pDPS, they are easily competing with (or likely surpassing) the total for both BLM and SMN. Melee DPS are still in a pretty darn good spot right now as well. (Though there is a good argument to be made about the nature of damage debuffs - looking at you piercing debuff) This is honestly some of the best class balance we've ever seen out of SE.

[Tex_Mex]

BLM is in a good spot atm, but for how minimal their gain is, (especially on certain fights) it's not spectacular enough to ignore a missing raise that smn brings. SMN is in a really BS strong place as THE meta caster.

Rdm could use some help though

I still don't think that nerfing SMN is the right solution. If you want to argue for anything, choose to buff BLM utility or something like that. BLM used to have the niche that it would never run out of MP, but this got removed with SB when resource management for all classes basically became a joke. Maybe some sort of group utility like a raid wide magic damage barrier could be introduced. That would fit with the job and add some non DPS related flavor to the game.

[Zerathor]

snip.

Utility would be neat, but it won't happen. If it did, they'd nerf their damage as well. Meaning a blm playing at maximum potential would be equal to a smn. How good does one shield need to be to be equal to being able to raise? It'd be a lot or have a low cd.