Black magic...kinda sucks

[GunksFoy]

The way I was suggesting the degradation occur was that at the end of the timer, as it is now, you lose one stack then the others on three second timers. Thus you effectively extend the timer by six seconds for mechanics and those still learning the class while preserving the full power for those who have mastered it. Without driving the dps of the job into a brick wall as soon as the timer runs out. That way those who mastered the class still keep that mechanic as is, but while making the job slightly more forgiving for those still learning it, and thus a little more appealing.

This goes to show you don't understand the job. If you are EVER running out of AF/UI, you're doing it wrong. Transpose has already solved the issue that you are trying to fix here, and in a better way than what you suggest. There is no benefit to having 2 stacks over 1 except a small MP reduction. You already lose the speed buff from being in AF/UI3, so 1 stack vs 2 stacks is pointless. The is challenging, but this is not one of it's issues.

Everything you've posted so far just shows us that you do not understand the job or lack the ability to press Transpose every 8s. That's fine, play something else. But again, stop trying to ruin BLM for those who do enjoy.

[Malkria]

This goes to show you don't understand the job.

Right...I don't understand a job that has one of the most simplistic rotations and play styles in the game. Yes transpose is an option, but at the same time when you are trying to squeeze in every last bit of DPS the server doesn't always register the switch in timer. Like I said, this is the ONLY job that feels like it drives into a brick wall once a timer goes off. There is no 'understanding a job' here, there is no skill needed here, it's if a timer goes off your DPS takes a sudden and immediate nose dive.

Furthermore, how am I trying to ruin BLM for anyone? What have I suggested would ruin the job? Change the play style, maybe get more people to play it, but ruin it? Maybe trying being less elitist. 9.9

No it does not suck in any shape or form. It is in fact, if played right, one of the strongest DPS jobs in the game.

Then everyone I talk to is apparently an idiot? Because I'm being told that BLM not only is NOT the strongest DPS but is also just not fun to play in a lot of my FC and friend's eyes. For a lot of the same reasons I've already talked about (hell it is one of the reasons I picked up the BLM to try it again).

Sorry, but i've spent the time up to 70 now playing the job and...it sucks. YES you have transpose and yes you have some instant cast options. But frankly the rotation is to simple, the mobility to bad, the punishment for making a mistake to severe, and the design over all doesn't mesh with how the game demands you play.

Like I said, I have played many a turret type job/class over the years. I can get behind wanting raw power...and frankly the BLM falls flat in this regard. The fact it is a 'selfish job' and still falls flat only makes it all the sadder.

[Kabooa]

Right...I don't understand a job that has one of the most simplistic rotations and play styles in the game.

Sounds about right.

[Malkria]

Sounds about right.

You know, for a group that seems to think everything is working as intended...you all are very defensive about a single voice giving protest. Or is it that I am NOT the only one pointing these things out? That maybe there might actually be some substance to what I am saying? In which case the way you all are so quick to defend this job despite it's issues becomes apparent. I wonder if you all reacted the same way to these "quality of life" changes that Square put forward in the expansion, and claimed it would kill the job then too?

[Kabooa]

You know, for a group that seems to think everything is working as intended...you all are very defensive about a single voice giving protest. Or is it that I am NOT the only one pointing these things out? That maybe there might actually be some substance to what I am saying? In which case the way you all are so quick to defend this job despite it's issues becomes apparent. I wonder if you all reacted the same way to these "quality of life" changes that Square put forward in the expansion, and claimed it would kill the job then too?

Black mage has issues. Transpose and timers are not among them.

[Popotato]

You know, for a group that seems to think everything is working as intended...you all are very defensive about a single voice giving protest. Or is it that I am NOT the only one pointing these things out? That maybe there might actually be some substance to what I am saying? In which case the way you all are so quick to defend this job despite it's issues becomes apparent. I wonder if you all reacted the same way to these "quality of life" changes that Square put forward in the expansion, and claimed it would kill the job then too?

Ah, what a classic logical fallacy. "If many people disagree with me, then I must have a valid point!" I don't understand how you can try to spin many people pointing out various flaws in your suggestions to mean you have a strong case.

There are many other people voicing their opinion on the flaws of BLM. The difference is that the problems they identify are actual problems. BLM does have problems, the thing is that the problems you identified aren't them. The other thing is that these people are likely BLM veterans who have some minor issues with recent changes. You are a player that is completely new to the job, and hate the playstyle that you had from the very start. You've had no previous iteration of BLM to love.

Since your arguments are purely anecdotal, I'll give an anecdote too. When I tried Ninja for the first time in level 70 content, I found it incredibly stressful and fast-paced. I was dropping combos, bunnying my mudras, dropping Huton, missing Trick Attacks. I was determined to get good at Ninja because I liked the aesthetic, so I played nothing but Ninja for a good week.

At the end of that week, I was still shit at Ninja.

Granted, I got a bit better, but still couldn't nail down the core aspects of the job. The thing is that I accept Ninja's playstyle as really fast-paced and heavy on cooldown management, and I accepted that the playstyle was stressful and not for me. I don't fault the players for liking the job. The job provides a unique, fast-paced experience that no other job provides, and I respect that. I decided to try other jobs hoping that one will click. And mind you, that job ISN'T Black Mage. I don't main Black Mage, I play it casually, in expert roulette, treasure hunts and normal raids, enough so that I can understand the intricacies of its design and appreciate the unique gameplay experience it provides.

I think the issue most people have with your suggestions, other than them addressing things that aren't problems, is that you imply that the job should be more like SMN. You say BLM is too immobile, it should be able to move more like SMN. People take issue with that because your agenda is to try and push a more homogenised BLM experience, which is something BLM players play the job specifically not to have.

The job has been dumbed down a lot since HW. If you hate the timer aspect of it, then you would have had so many qualms with HW Enochian. But the fact of the matter is that timers and immobility have always been a pretty central aspect of BLM's playstyle. People that have played the job since ARR likely are attracted to these two aspects of the job, and if they changed that, they have every right to be annoyed. Look at the 3.x MCH and SMN mains.

[Dualgunner]

Then everyone I talk to is apparently an idiot? Because I'm being told that BLM not only is NOT the strongest DPS but is also just not fun to play in a lot of my FC and friend's eyes. For a lot of the same reasons I've already talked about (hell it is one of the reasons I picked up the BLM to try it again).

It depends on the context they said that it's not the strongest DPS. If they're talking meta, yes it is not a meta job. For personal DPS, though, yes it is definitely one of, if not the, most powerful DPS in the game. Don't take my word for it, or your friends', go look at the FFLogs rankings for DPS.

It's clear you dislike the gameplay style. But it is not a bad gameplay style. Move on and find a job you like better.

You know, for a group that seems to think everything is working as intended...you all are very defensive about a single voice giving protest. Or is it that I am NOT the only one pointing these things out?

This forum just likes pointing out when people are wrong. It kills a lot of time because there are a lot of wrong people here.

[Malkria]

This forum just likes pointing out when people are wrong. It kills a lot of time because there are a lot of wrong people here.

Except that it seems that a LOT of people want BLM to either have more versatility, mobility, and/or a more interesting rotation. So I question who is in the 'wrong' here.

It's clear you dislike the gameplay style. But it is not a bad gameplay style. Move on and find a job you like better.

No, it is not that I don't like the play style. I have played, and enjoyed, the turret play style. Even to the point where I played abilities literally called "turret mode". Like I have said, those games do it better, and also design the game AROUND the inclusion of said abilities. To which while I understand that Yoshi likes BLM, the point wasn't ever that the job isn't playable. It's that the job is by far the most punishing for mistakes while not bringing much to the table to justify it.

The job could in so may ways still keep this 'turret style" dps while still having more mobility. Hell in ways that would also potentially make it more group orientated. But the first step is admitting the job stands to gain a lot more then lose if changed at all.

[Thela]

Like I said, I have played many a turret type job/class over the years. I can get behind wanting raw power...and frankly the BLM falls flat in this regard. The fact it is a 'selfish job' and still falls flat only makes it all the sadder.

I'm sorry but what? Sacrifice mobility for raw power is the premise of the job, and it does succeed at exactly that, raw power. I'm not sure how you can claim it falls flat when it does in fact provide the highest DPS in the game when done right.

I don't think anyone here will claim its a flawless job, it does have its flaws, but the things you list are just not accurate. It's fine you don't like the style, but the fact is that it is the highest damage job in the game when done right (for a single target boss fight, which is most of them), so your claims to the contrary are just inaccurate.

[Bunnycake]

Then everyone I talk to is apparently an idiot? Because I'm being told that BLM not only is NOT the strongest DPS but is also just not fun to play in a lot of my FC and friend's eyes. For a lot of the same reasons I've already talked about (hell it is one of the reasons I picked up the BLM to try it again).

BLM is the strongest DPS caster tho. Maybe said people you talked to don't know how to BLM as well. Astros and Dragoons sure as heck choose me over than RDMs and SMNs when it comes to buffing. ¯\_(ツ)_/ ¯