Define a good player

[Sigma-Astra]

Nothing I said in that was savage was bad; the point was rather that no matter how you define "good" there's always a higher step defined by other people. I used the progression there to show that even as you fulfill "good" conditions, there's always something people can use to look down on you.

Well, yes, again, that's the point. Everyone has their own merits and criteria for what they deem acceptable and unacceptable behavior. It's just like the real world in that regard. That's why I don't understand what else you were expecting from this thread, yet still felt the need to post in it and say that there's no point and complain about everyone's idea, not even showing constructive criticism about it because all you've offered on the table is "there's no point" and "just play the game and have fun" which doesn't add anything else to the conversation. It's no different than walking into a job and your potential employer having certain criteria and merits that they expect you to have over the person standing next to you that may display even better quality traits or completely abyssal ones instead. Just because you find that the concepts of a "good player" or "bad player" are dumb doesn't deny their existence or deny others from having certain standards and upholding those standards.

Then you can structure the game so you have fun; only play with friends, leave bad runs, vote kick the bad players, etc. Obsessing about them being bad does what?

It's impossible to only play with friends in a 24 man raid unless I have 24 friends all on at the same time from the same server or different servers on my Datacenter to run it with. After queuing for 15 minutes, why should I leave a bad run because a player thinks it's hilarious to stay dying on the floor five times in a row? How can I kick them if it's not a group majority vote? It's not really obsessing about bad players so much as it's just me expecting, you know, other players to be somewhat competent and realize that the orange puddle means death after the fifth time.

You want everyone to just ignore these factors and play the game and have fun, which I guess could be said that they are your standards, however, you're still not going to convince anyone here that we should just casually ignore these things in favor of "just have fun guys". A person can be bad and enjoy the game, great...that doesn't mean I have to enjoy them being bad in order to enjoy my playtime either.

Fun is subjective for everyone.