Quit Ruining The General Discussions

[KaivaC]

snip

Which is fine...FFXIV has been very divisive all throughout 4.x. But how many threads have cropped up about reasons for unsubbing (not including the joke ones). How many threads have popped up, all revolving around the app in some way, form or fashion? How many other threads got derailed about these two things lately? Being negative (sometimes rightfully so) is one thing, but it's another when it becomes this widespread. The mods aren't going to look at this and go 'oh, players are really angry, we should get this to the dev team'. There's enough anger here that if you coordinated it, you could probably get an outlet to actually comment on it. Yes, Square isn't nearly as open to feedback as other developers are. But spreading anger across several threads over multiple pages is not an effective way of doing anything, in my opinion.

[Vhailor]

Which is fine; people are of course allowed their own opinions. But there are certain posters on here that argue just for the sake of arguing in every single thread, as well as creating their own thread just to continue arguing. It gets to be little annoying when they start picking fights with every poster left and right, and does not make for reasonable discussion nor debate. The posters that act so antagonistic like that are actually more likely to make the developers completely ignore and/or dismiss their complaints because of their unreasonable and abrasive nature. They don’t provide constructive criticism, only negativity.

A fair point as well, but, again, I draw a distinction between telling people to shush, and venting. I think KaivaC crossed the line on that one, probably deliberately, but that's why I'm responding in this manner.

I'm not trying to be offensive or pick a fight with you, but.....you're basically contradicting yourself and doing exactly what you're telling others not to do here.

No, I'm not. I simply used decisive language to state the principle of neutrality and emphasize self-determination. I think that was clear enough from the context, but I'm also up later than normal, so maybe it isn't. *shrugs*

I can respect what you're saying, because you said it in a respectful manner. And I will respond in the same respectful manner. I don't think that the complaints are invalid. I may not agree with them, but I recognize that people have legitimate concerns. But the same issues are being brought up repeatedly and they are going nowhere. In my opinion, these complaints really are not going anywhere. True, you are restricted to 40 characters on the support website, but in that same token, what has been the most reasonable way to get the devs to take notice of something: gaming websites, huge unsub numbers, things of that nature. Keep in mind, my comments are not directed at those who have issues with the game and want to unsub. They are specifically for those who have been constantly complaining about the exact same things for the last week and a half.

Again, I have no problems with complaints. What I'm pointing at right now is the same ones constantly occurring over multiple threads that it feels like nothing positive can be talked about right now.

It's a fair point, to be sure. I can empathize. I routinely get driven nuts by a variety of forum topics. I'm simply pointing out that whether a thread is useful or not is somewhat in the eye of the beholder. As an example, suppose you're absolutely right - that the complaints aren't going anywhere, that it's not constructive in any way, etc. Isn't it possible, indeed likely, that those who continue to create and respond to the threads still get value out of it? Even venting for the sake of venting can be useful. I suspect you found it therapeutic to craft this thread, too - despite the fact that you surely know it isn't likely to dent the negativity floating through the forums right now.

I'm curious, by the way - do you find it difficult to ignore the negative threads on the forums? I know when I pop on, I tend to glance through the list, identify the threads with titles that interest me (or that I've posted in), and then settle in to read and engage. There are a number of posts that I couldn't care less about, because I find them to be boring or aggravating. They never so much as catch my eye. I'd be interested to know if your experience and approach is significantly different.

[Solarra]

The thing that I have noticed and which bothers me, isn't the type of thread being made, it's that the atmosphere in some threads has grown particularly hostile.
I know feelings are going to run high when a topic is controversial but recently it seems there are a lot of people launching personal attacks rather than debating the points that have been made, nit-picking over semantics or just generally being rude. e.g. expressing joy that someone has unsubbed, telling people to unsub or simply going into a thread to say, 'I don't care'. None of that adds anything to the discussion but it does set a very hostile tone.

[ShadowHunterrX]

Which is fine...

Jep, that is *your* opinion. That's is fine and I dont disagree. But there negative input is also there opinion, if you like it or not. But I understand both point of views in most things.

You guys make like it's good and evil. Which is not true.

[Zephanoa]

This pretty much sums it up.

[KaivaC]

It's a fair point, to be sure. I can empathize. I routinely get driven nuts by a variety of forum topics. I'm simply pointing out that whether a thread is useful or not is somewhat in the eye of the beholder. As an example, suppose you're absolutely right - that the complaints aren't going anywhere, that it's not constructive in any way, etc. Isn't it possible, indeed likely, that those who continue to create and respond to the threads still get value out of it? Even venting for the sake of venting can be useful. I suspect you found it therapeutic to craft this thread, too - despite the fact that you surely know it isn't likely to dent the negativity floating through the forums right now.

I'm curious, by the way - do you find it difficult to ignore the negative threads on the forums? I know when I pop on, I tend to glance through the list, identify the threads with titles that interest me (or that I've posted in), and then settle in to read and engage. There are a number of posts that I couldn't care less about, because I find them to be boring or aggravating. They never so much as catch my eye. I'd be interested to know if your experience and approach is significantly different.

Have I gone overboard in my initial post? Possibly. My primary issue with the particular complaints that I'm addressing is that, if the poster intended to have an actual discussion about it for a particular subject, why would they confront everybody who disagrees and give off this aura that flat out says, 'No, you're absolutely wrong; there is no middle ground in this; I'm right and you're wrong; if you don't agree with me 100%, then you're in the wrong'. This is not just a single poster. Nor is it just on one side of the lines that have been drawn in many of these threads. It's been snippy back and forth arguments that seems to be about who can win the like contest by having the best snippy response.

Now with that being said, I can't lie, I have gotten very snippy myself recently, more so than usual, but that was in response to something else, and even in that thread, it's starting to merge into P2W/app rage. Usually, I do zero in towards the topics that interest me, or I'll throw up something that I intend to have discussions about. As it stands right now, I can't exactly ignore them because they're just so many of them. I have a strong preference for threads that I can have a discussion in. I usually won't comment in longer discussions unless it's something that really draws my attention.

This pretty much sums it up.

I recognize the irony here...still gave you a +1 like.

[Mhaeric]

I don't mind people complaining...hell, I am complained plenty of times about things here on the forums. But those threads actually went somewhere.

Yeah, because this complaint thread is Goin' Places™

[KaivaC]

Yeah, because this complaint thread is Goin' Places™

Are you actually going to say anything productive here or just continue trolling me? Would rather know now so I know to not respond to or pay attention to what you say.

[Cidel]

Yeah, because this complaint thread is Goin' Places™

Yeah, I foresee a thread lock/deletion.


Until then- nachos anyone?

[Mhaeric]

Are you actually going to say anything productive here or just continue trolling me? Would rather know now so I know to not respond to or pay attention to what you say.

What is there productive to say in a thread that's is nothing but complaining about other people complaining? There's nothing worth actually discussing here. All you're doing is trying to get people to agree with you or getting the complainers riled up.