The reason I stay subbed....

[Okamimaru]

Do you like being ripped off? That "premium" you are already paying for when you buy the game, the expansions, and the sub. Do not forget you pay a months fee? SE is trying to change people twice for the same thing,

wait we already have a way to use the MB, linkshells, retainers, storage from our mobile phones? Did anybody inform SE that their app is redundant? You pay your monthly sub for access to the game and it's content... the app and it's associated fees are for REMOTE ACCESS to those services... they are NOT charging you twice to log in and play they game from your console or pc... they are charging you to access certain features remotely...

[Callinon]

I thought Kotaku was a bad thing to use as a reference... :thoughtful:

I'm not aware anyone said that, but would you prefer the source it's based on instead? Would that be ok?

https://www.reddit.com/r/FFBraveExvi...ale_of_a_tale/

[Sigma-Astra]

I'm not aware anyone said that, but would you prefer the source it's based on instead? Would that be ok?

https://www.reddit.com/r/FFBraveExvi...ale_of_a_tale/

It's just been a growing sort of "meme" around the internet and other forums where accepting something from Kotaku is almost as bad as using Wiki as a source of evidence considering that both can be hyperbole sometimes and one of the two can actually be edited by anyone. And over the years, a lot of Kotaku stuff has been really "click baity" sometimes, but honestly, that can be said for any social media nowadays where sensationalizing and overblowing a topic seems to be the new trend.

I'm not sure if we should say reddit is any better though. /shrugs

That's just my take on it. Interesting read though, nevertheless. It really puts things into perspective how people really need to be careful when they play these types of games because $1 for a small purchase to get ahead can sometimes equal and blow up to become over $100 within a single month before you know it.

It's kind of sad too, hopefully the guy learned his lesson about managing his finances a bit better since every time you click yes towards those "Pay $1 for 50 gems" type scenarios, there's a ToS you're agreeing with and a "Yes or No" button that needs to be clicked before making the purchase. It all depends on the person's own willpower, you know?

My brother-in-law plays Exvius, never spent a dime on additional features and just plays for free. Kudos towards him, but he's like....the most frugal person I know, more so than me sometimes. >_<;

[Krotoan]

I'm not aware anyone said that, but would you prefer the source it's based on instead? Would that be ok?

https://www.reddit.com/r/FFBraveExvi...ale_of_a_tale/

This references a "gatcha" system though, which would be irrelevant to FFXIV's services for cash plans. You know exactly what you're getting for the money here, whether it's worth it or not is up to you. The house always wins in gambling, this isn't a new thing.

[Talraen]

I am not, you are the one mistaken. Maybe in an ideal world you are right, but this is what happens in the real world:
http://www.kotaku.co.uk/2017/12/14/t...ost-his-family
It is exploitation, it is not doing anyone favors like you are implying.
second off its 15 dollars, for 36 dollars total a month, that is whaling, supporting overpay for stuff that should be in the base sub. Plus you need consider mog station and the moogle coins on top of it.

Wait, what? I said that companies exploit whales and non-whales benefit, and you linked me an article about a whale who was so exploited he lost his family. So... thanks for making my point, I guess? Do you think games like that would be free to play without guys like this? That's what I mean when I say "non-whales benefit." The game is free because a small number of fools are spending the money most of the players aren't.

This guy spent $16,000 on one game. It's literally not possible to spend that much on a single FFXIV character unless 95% of it is spent on dyes. Free to play models trap whales by having infinitely repeatable microtransactions, almost always with a random mechanic involved. FFXIV does not have that, and nothing they've done is remotely like that. Having a premium subscription fee is a far cry from taking 16 grand from one person, and I've already provided the math that lays out why.

[Hestzhyen]

This references a "gatcha" system though, which would be irrelevant to FFXIV's services for cash plans. You know exactly what you're getting for the money here, whether it's worth it or not is up to you. The house always wins in gambling, this isn't a new thing.

This app is a different sort of exploitation with the same basic hook: set an artificially low limit to piss people off enough that they'll buy your bs access mechanisms. Read the story of the guy that Callinon linked- that's not someone who's addicted to the highs of winning it big so much as he feels pissed off that he's not getting what he's owed and what he deserves. He'd probably spend a ton of money on the upcoming companion app if he felt the same way about the once a day limit on one of the main draws (twice a day if he pays for the privilege!). It's carefully crafted psychological manipulation to annoy enough people into buying your overpriced and entirely unnecessary restriction removers to turn sweet, sweet record profits. They'll happily take the money of anyone who will give it for the occasional purchase of course. But they're really looking to profit on the people with poor impulse control, addictive tendencies, and poor rationalization of cost-to-benefit ratios. It's starting small with market board functionality. They plan to expand it already and I have no desire to see who they're going to target next- I hope it dies in a pile of misery like it deserves for using such shady tactics.

This app isn't a gacha. But it's the same dirty trickery to turn a profit in an extremely under-handed and manipulative way.

[Vstarstruck]

This app is a different sort of exploitation with the same basic hook: set an artificially low limit to piss people off enough that they'll buy your bs access mechanisms. Read the story of the guy that Callinon linked- that's not someone who's addicted to the highs of winning it big so much as he feels pissed off that he's not getting what he's owed and what he deserves. He'd probably spend a ton of money on the upcoming companion app if he felt the same way about the once a day limit on one of the main draws (twice a day if he pays for the privilege!). It's carefully crafted psychological manipulation to annoy enough people into buying your overpriced and entirely unnecessary restriction removers to turn sweet, sweet record profits. They'll happily take the money of anyone who will give it for the occasional purchase of course. But they're really looking to profit on the people with poor impulse control, addictive tendencies, and poor rationalization of cost-to-benefit ratios. It's starting small with market board functionality. They plan to expand it already and I have no desire to see who they're going to target next- I hope it dies in a pile of misery like it deserves for using such shady tactics.

This app isn't a gacha. But it's the same dirty trickery to turn a profit in an extremely under-handed and manipulative way.

Yeah and the point is, SE is not completely innocent (keep in mind I first bought it up to be met with "do not trust kotaku so Callinon linked reddit form) since they have a game like that, so this app even as a base, is not completely innocent as well. There is no reason what so ever to have it set up like it is for a base, other then to be explosive in the same manner.

It is a simple fact SE set up the markets to need undercut spam, so people that want to keep selling things will need to keep undercut spam, hence spending tons of money to do so, esp if it ends up being more streamlined in the game. Again no one comments when I say, what if this app lets you adjust 1 item without taking the other 19 items off the MB? if it is streamlined like that, some people will be using it at home while playing the game, it is a HUGE advantage.

same thing with moving items retainer to retainer, if I did not care/ had a lot of money to toss around, I would exploit this app an ef ton just so I do not have my items taken down from the MB as I do sorting and such. It is a huge advantage if it ends up being this streamlined. (even if it is not, still a big advantage to price change as you do other things, if you are really deep in crafting and selling, the slow menus appear to be very slow and annoying that your stuff can't be sold because of it. Also for a little fyi, a retainer will reject your call if you ring it the same time someone bought your thing (pretty sure i got the sale message after i hit the bell request) so there is def some slow processing going on there.

[Krotoan]

This app isn't a gacha. But it's the same dirty trickery to turn a profit in an extremely under-handed and manipulative way.

Dirty? Where is the part you have to participate to be relevant or to compete? ON the MB? ... Mayyybe. I don't really craft so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt there. I will argue though that someone with NO money can still effectively compete if they're willing to spend more time in game, you're paying for the privilege of convenience, not access. On that point it is CRAZY more expensive to compete remotely than it is to do so just when you're home. If someone wants to blow 500 dollars on being "king of the marketboards" I cannot fault a company for making that avenue open to them. Do you consider fast food places predatory since they make fatty, unhealthy food easily available (some even have delivery)? People need to have some self control and until we stop blaming companies and make it understood the problem ISN'T with making it available it's with giving excuses for people to enable themselves, that isn't going to stop.

I won't pay more real money for access to what I had access before for free, but if something additional is offered for money it is entirely up to me whether that's worth it or not. Whether they withheld options they could have implemented in game JUST to monetize them is debatable indeed, but I still have seen no evidence to show such practice was intended or has happened.

[Sigma-Astra]

This app is a different sort of exploitation with the same basic hook: set an artificially low limit to piss people off enough that they'll buy your bs access mechanisms. Read the story of the guy that Callinon linked- that's not someone who's addicted to the highs of winning it big so much as he feels pissed off that he's not getting what he's owed and what he deserves.

I read it and the guy did state towards the end that he had a serious gambling addiction problem regarding the game. He fully admitted towards it. When you're admitting towards the idea that you have a gambling addiction, you are in fact becoming addicted towards the sensation and joy that happens when you theoretically "win" something. It's how casinos stay open after all. You have a percentage of people that can quit while they're ahead and another percentage of people that don't know how to resist bad impulses. Honestly, I would akin "gacha games" as basically impulse buying at it's finest as you touched upon it yourself too. "Poor Impulse control, addictive tendencies, and poor foresight on the person themselves". But, that's what gacha games are and made for. They're mobile gambling games and like it or not, there's always going to be people that want to play them unfortunately.

And getting rid of gacha games is like going on a crusade to get rid of casinos.

[Kacho_Nacho]

You are the problem.

No, he's the market. You may not like the app; but, other people do.

However, I do see there is an issue. We are paying subscription fees and paying for expansions while the cash shop is offering more and more of the good stuff. It's starting to feel we are getting less of a full game for our money and are expected to pay these additional fees to get it.