Thread: 4.3: The Geomancers

Um...What's the point of this discussion about the NPC, really?! In this game gladiator NPC's can heal. An ex-warrior NPC at lvl60 heals for ~10000HP with a spell that I don't recall seeing. Black mages use spells not available to players. Same with just about any other class.

Don't base anything on NPC's and their skill sets. Yes, the LORE suggests that if they will come, they're more likely to come as healers. Frankly I hope not...at least not in 5.0 seeing as I want a dancer and for it to be a healer and I doubt we'd get two healers...but hey.

By the way, Black Magic and White Magic have the same origin as far as I remember the lore related to them. Black magic as it is was simply formed when Shantotto decided that she's not happy with just her own aether cause it limits how much boom and blast she can do so she invented a way to draw in outside aether. That's all. There is no reason to assume that there are no branches of geomancers that are basically any of the three roles. Ones focused on destroying evil (DPS), ones on wards (tanks) and ones on restoring damage caused by evil (healers). The NPC's grandfather (or was it father?!) could have been the "wards" type, seeing as he made a ward powerful enough to hold the beast for so long without sacrificing anyone's life.

Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

Tanks are inferior in protecting other party members compared to Scholar and Astrologian in Nocturnal Sect, and are equal to a Diurnal AST thanks to Collective Unconscious having shields backed into it. White Mage is behind those two but with Divine Benison they're actually on par with Dark Knight with how well they can prevent damage to other party members. That's just remembering skills, it's far, far from their role to do so. (EDIT: admitting to slightly misread that and focused on party defense. but the point still holds in that all healers have shielding capabilities, with SCH's shields being its thing and AST having an option at it. Shields are hardly a Tank exclusive thing)
Then we have our AST NPC wanting to study under Leveva. Their arts are said to be roughly identical, the source of the aether they call upon is different, that's all. Geomancers being tanks makes no sense within the lore established for them and their comparisons within the game so far. I agree letting them be tank would be about the only way in which they can have a right to exist within the game, as between CNJ and AST they're redundant, but it's that role switch that's a problem.

Tell that to a warrior casting shake it off, a drk casting blackest knight, and a paldin casting the wings. Point is, the tank role is also a protect role. In fact, tanking is more about protecting than the healer role is, healing is the curing role. But I see you admitted that point was right in your edit.

On your point about Leveva, he went to learn how to heal, something Geomancers are not good at, which is why, we, the real astrologians had to be there to really heal the demon spirit.

Makes sense, they do call upon the same elements. Cure is a wind spell.

Just so that we're clear, Geomancer is not solely an elemental mage. Geomancer is directly related to the natural flow of the earth which consists of using the earth as a source of energy which is closer to using the environment as a weapon/tool rather than just summoning the elements (fire, wind, earth; the elements are limited to their properties). The environment on the other hand isn't limited to the elements, a geomancer can summon lava from below or turn air into a tornado or even mix that tornado to create a hurricane, sandstorms, dust storms. Furthermore it's not limited to air effects, it could use any natural object or fauna it can find (grass, trees, or even stone (oh! they removed stoneskin from healers, hmm wonder if it's coming back).

Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

Nymian Scholars would like to have a word with you about the role you assigned to them

This have literally no sense whatsoever.

First, I was talking about geomancers. All three tanks use some sort of party-protecting ability. Maybe Nymian Scholars want to have a word with them too?!

Second, Nymian Scholars are known for their STRATEGY. The shields are not actually related to the lore directly as far as I can remember from doing the scholars quests. There is nothing in the lore to my knowledge saying that they cast protecting shields over their allies. It's just a mechanical effect, just like Resurrect doesn't actually resurrect and "dead" players aren't actually dead. That's why player can't REALLY resurrect the people that die, like Moenbryda etc. And there's a bunch of other stuff like this, too. Heck, astrologians cards are just like that.

The shields, in my opinion at least, represent the scholars commanding a person in such a way as to have them avoid the approaching damage through outsmarting the opponent. That is in tune with their strategic lore. Know your enemy and all that stuff.

Originally Posted by LastFireAce

Well 5.0 for me would be Geomancer, Blue Mage , Dancer

-Dancer ----------> Extra Collector Edition only (you know, the one a 250 bucks)
-Blue Mage ------> Unlock on Cash Shop only (limited in time)
-Geomancer------> Only available with premium sub on the app (and you'll have to use one moogle coin a day to play the job)

Please, look forward to it !

Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

I agree letting them be tank would be about the only way in which they can have a right to exist within the game, as between CNJ and AST they're redundant, but it's that role switch that's a problem.

Given that Geomancer (Feng Shui) lore was lost and the one guy in the AST storyline is the only one who knows any of it, needed the AST's help to band-aid the seals to Kugane, not make new ones, I think if it's introduced, it's already been pigeon-holed as a healer. "Kyokuho of Wind and Water" = reads exactly like a Conjurer.

But that to the OP, the geomancer stuff is just lore. Just like there is a Musketeer guild, but no Musketeer class in the game.

Anyone who has played most of the job quests, and was paying attention would remember there's references to a lot of "ancient" things that are no longer in the world, (or even no longer in the world as of 2.0)

So just based on the bits already in the game, read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feng_shui and take a look at how it overlaps with the current patch 4.1+ MSQ storyline. Taken literately, Geomancy would have to be a healer or a tank.

I stand corrected on Scholars and their shields.

Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

If that still doesn't sell you on that point, feel free to tell me how Noct ASTs are tanks. Because those had an entire quest line about enforcing a geomancer's wards with that sect.

However, you still miss the point. I never said that wards and shields define a tank. I said that there would be nothing weird with there being a tank geomancer, with it being a branch focusing on wards. It have NOTHING to do with any other job at all.

Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

Basically everything that happens in combat is canon.

I'm not talking about "what happens in combat" and all that. I'm talking about there being skills that are merely mechanical representations of effects, while the skills themselves are, lore-wise, doing something else (though related). Best seen with Spear on Astrologian. While its lore remained the same, its effect is vastly different. Clearly it's made to match this being a game, thus there are gaming mechanics. That's what is being talked here about.

I wouldn't be surprised if we got geomancer as a healer or a caster variant of BRD/MCH

they really like using FFXI as a starting point it feels like and geomancer is a full on support in that. They were so good at support in fact that groups would often drop a dps for a second geomancer. Lorewise they even make the geomancers out like they are very similar to astrologian but terrestrial vs cosmic so that would hint at the next healer.

You only meet one and it is during a job questline but he hints that it is a group