Thread: New Loot System for Raids from 4.3 on

oh this will be an absolute mess.

There is a reason other MMOs moved away from the system they are proposing. There's a reason there is a term "Ninja Looting". There is a reason why everything works like it does.

If they want people to be able to get gear cross class various systems exist for that, tokens and other methods are there for that very purpose. Having to Greed on your own gear means that you may have to run the raid over and over and over and over and over and over and over...

"I might play a tank some day, so I will roll greed on tank gear." That guys tank might not even be level 1. Just saying!

While I do see the reasoning for why people would be in favor of it, this honestly is going to do more harm than good and I see more animosity stemming from the system if/when it goes live.

From the last 4.3 Raid Loot discussion thread, it sounds like this whole new Greed-only idea was thought-up to benefit the JP base who feel compelled to come as their best-geared job (I know the feeling), but then don't want to get "Need-outrolled" on gear they want on a different, not-as-geared role. In my eyes, this is an incredibly shallow reason to eliminate "Need," and worse yet in content that has more competition for loot (7 others vs just 3) and by far the one (non-ultimate/savage) content that takes the longest to commit to.

So what if you get someone in the raid (let's say RDM) who legitimately sees a caster drop that is an upgrade for them right then and there and then they get Greed-outrolled by a tank or some melee DPS who wants it for one of their casters- which might even be for glamour? Speaking of which, this doesn't even account for people who want pieces purely for glamour, which is a legit reason for people to roll on something (they like how it looks). Unless the devs feel like doing what they seemingly do best and reusing old gear models for 24-man raid drops so the only thing worth winning gear for is purely stat upgrades.

Originally Posted by Cidel

So what if you get someone in the raid (let's say RDM) who legitimately sees a caster drop that is an upgrade for them right then and there and then they get Greed-outrolled by a tank or some melee DPS who wants it for one of their casters- which might even be for glamour?

Key words here being 'might'.

Lets say someone plays as their 'alt' Red Mage who doesn't need any more gear, while some current red Mage gear drops and you happen to be playing on your fully geared Tank but you ungeared Red mage could do wit it?

It's all a two-way street. It's all hypothetical 'what ifs'. For some this will be a detriment and for others a boon.
Some however are just averse to change whatever it is.

People often feel compelled to play is jobs that aren't the ones they're trying to gear up atm. Tanks and Healers get through queues quicker for example, or they've come as part of a pre-made party who already have 4 DPS and someone had to draw the short straw.

There is nothing at all positive about this, those who have horrible luck with the current system may as well not bother running the 24 mans now and tanks and healers who may actually need the gear may loose to someone who has a lvl15 Maurader.
I get what they are attempting to do it is just going to have the reverse effect.

Originally Posted by Seraphor

Key words here being 'might'.

Lets say someone plays as their 'alt' Red Mage who doesn't need any more gear, while some current red Mage gear drops and you happen to be playing on your fully geared Tank but you ungeared Red mage could do wit it?

Okay? So the person on RDM "doesn't need any more gear?" So they're either not rolling at all or rolling for glamour? If not winning the drop for a job you're not even playing (in a 24-man raid meant for more casual playstyles) to someone who bothered to queue up as a caster and happened to get lucky and see a caster drop they happened to want... is unfair how?

It's all a two-way street. It's all hypothetical 'what ifs'. For some this will be a detriment and for others a boon.

Of course it's hypothetical "what ifs," the whole premise of them even trying to change the Loot rules comes from the "what if somebody wants drops of another role but loses to people actually participating in the content as said role when they roll Need?"

Some however are just averse to change whatever it is.

Right, so when there's a large backlash from the playerbase, they're all just "averse to change-" not because they find fault with an idea?

People often feel compelled to play is jobs that aren't the ones they're trying to gear up atm.

Guilty. But you know what? I never feel like I'm more deserving of a specific piece of equipment over somebody who is currently participating in the content of the matching role. If I am serious enough about wanting something for either an upgrade or glamour, I will queue-up as that role.

Tanks and Healers get through queues quicker for example

And now it's possible to queue up quickly and be able to outroll the DPS on gear they might actually need as an upgrade. Sounds about right.

Originally Posted by Cidel

Right, so when there's a large backlash from the playerbase, they're all just "averse to change-" not because they find fault with an idea?

Yes... that's exactly what I just said...

Thing is, I play multiple classes.
I play DRK, AST, BLM and SAM, all pretty much equally, and need gear for all of them. Because I actually play as part of a community and will use the job that's required for the party set up at the time, because I'm not a douche who only looks out for myself.
It feels like 99% of the time, caster gear drops when i'm NOT playing BLM, or healer gear drops when i'm playing something other than AST. (although statistically that's 'only' 75%, it's still the majority of the time)
I basically never have a chance at getting the gear I need, because I never get a chance to 'Need' the gear, even though I play all four of those classes.
It would be nice to actually get a chance to roll for some of this stuff instead of being automatically locked out because someone else just happens to be "the right class at the right time". It would be nice to get a chance to roll for the gear I need without being penalized for being the wrong class.

Who really only plays one class and one class only?

Like I said, dungeons are different. They're quicker, and you're competing against fewer people, with a more balance party role composition. They also tend to drop more equipment.