turbo controllers the new bot crafting?

[Gospel]

*adds to list*

How to Troll FFXIV Forums 101

-Something FFXI related
-Speak in third person
-Time attack
-Bad grammar
"-Turbo Controllers"
-Talking about other MMO's
-RMT
-Player parameters

and the best way to troll out of all them.

-Stating our own personal opinions.

This thread is amazing by the way.

[Rydin]

All they would have to do it prevent turbo controllers being an issue is make it so you dont just have to hit a single butting repeatedly, throw and UP in there or Down and problem solved (for turbo controllers anyway)

You would think that... but the thing is... for a LONG TIME... you did need to press down to start the next synth and in 1.19 SE changed it so you didn't....
It was a very small change (The cursor defaults to "Recipes" as opposed to Requested Items") with very big ramifications...
Which begs the question... did SE see this coming?

[Laraul]

Crafting is mountainous, repetitive, and uses almost no high level brain functions. So, why is using a turbo feature to assist a player with crafting so frowned upon? All you do is push the same button over and over. This is what the "turbo" feature is designed to do. I don't see how this "turbo" issue is negatively effecting the game for other players.

Is this so different from being power leveled by another player while you sit and watch TV or read a book (or go shopping)? NO. Let it go.

[Soulfire]

@soulfire

what the hell do you think "automation software" means

technicaly, thats exactly what your turbo control becomes if you leave it on while you are afk

how can you not understand this?

Again with the belief I'm the one lacking in understanding? w
I said there was no point arguing further, and I said it for good reason.

[DardGhalawad]

So, I know that SE states that they don't allow 3rd party programs to in the game. But aren't Turbo controllers the same thing except the program is on your controller? The LS I WAS in clearly states "NO BOTTERS" so if someone can stay up all night crafting or stay on all day crafting. While they're either asleep or at work how is that not botting? I think maybe SE should consider changing their policy on this subject.

/10 flame resist (after that I'm screwed! >.<)

Edit:

Had to post this in the OP it's too good.

They even admitted to afking all night with they're turbo controllers on and everyone was ok with it.

OMG another witch hunt on the loose!

All they would have to do it prevent turbo controllers being an issue is make it so you dont just have to hit a single butting repeatedly, throw and UP in there or Down and problem solved (for turbo controllers anyway)

Didn't they put the choice from leves button recipes into the normal ones, because ppl, and I mean everyone, asked for it? They did!

the problem isnt people watching tv etc etc while doing this though

the problem is people who are literaly afk while having the control doing so

i watch tv while hitting enter, and i can easily pay attention to the screen at the same time(tells tend to stand out of course)



and in the end, yes, you can blame the players, if a player cheats, its his fault, its not the games fault, its not the controlers fault, its not the program hes using fault
he made a concious choice to cheat, its his fault

Watching tv while pressing enter and pay attention to the tells, if i dont know the ppl that sends me tells i usually ignore + /blist

but yeah at this point in the game, accusing anyone of anything based on their levels is a bit rediculous
HOWEVER, accusing someone who goes from 1-50 in a craft in a week is not....(there are those doing it)

Going from 1 to 50 in a week it is not possible unless they also use exp scrolls and even if they do, I still dont buy that it can be done in a week.

I used to play Evony many moons ago and that game is rife with botters despite the game having a far better defined anti-cheating policy than FFXIV.
From experience unless there are enough formal complaints about a player the company who runs/owns the game will do very little to police their own policies over this the moment there is money involved.
To start ousting players at critical time such as this for FFXIV (implementation of subs,game incomplete etc) would be detrimental to its success and most likely its existence.
To all those "anti-botters",take heart from the fact that you are only really in competition with yourself as there is currently no PVP,that is when it will become a real issue.
Should PVP be implemented expect the game to become utterly intrenched in botting as SE will regard botters subs just as acceptable as everyone elses
Sorry if this offends/annoys anyone but sadly I've experienced it many times-you either deal with it or quit.
Money talks here im afraid ,all other moral questions are secondary

Agree with that logic, but not with this witch hunt!

Further more, hardware companies that make those controllers also make personalized keyboards with various buttons key functions, turbo button, macros key, turbo delay function, etc etc.
But its fun to see mindless ppl making an huge storm in small cup of water.

Quote Originally Posted by TheVedis View Post
you cant make that an excuse for botting, it still doesnt fly


i dont think you understand whats going on

it is ok to use a turbo control

BUT

it is not ok to leave it on while afk

there is a big difference that seperates the 2 and people cant justify botting by stating "se lets us do it"

in the end, the terms of service flat out say you cant do it, and thats the bottom line
No, they don't. That's the issue.

There are two things that count here, and they would be the rules and policies as listed under SQUARE ENIX Account and FINAL FANTASY XIV.

FINAL FANTASY® XIV User Agreement
Last Updated: 8/16/2011

2.1 Cheating and Botting. You may not create or use any cheats, bots, automation software, hacks, mods or any other unauthorized software designed to modify the Game and gameplay. In addition, you may not take advantage of game system bugs and exploits during gameplay.
At this time there is NO definition of terms regarding botting or automation software. Thus this is far too cryptic, and the fallback is the standard concept that bots and automation software are software programs. This does not include controllers as people view them as hardware.


Ah, here's something better.
Prohibited Activities in Final Fantasy XIV

Activities that destroy game balance
Using third party programs or tools in FINAL FANTASY XIV is strictly prohibited since they allow users to gain an unfair advantage over other players. The use of programs or tools within FINAL FANTASY XIV that allow certain continuous actions to be performed automatically are often referred to as absentee play, which is also prohibited in FINAL FANTASY XIV. Additionally, during the course of an absentee play investigation, players may be requested to respond to or comply with a GMs instruction. Failure to do so is consider a violation and may result in disciplinary action being taken against the account.
So I don't really get "tools" in terms of computers too well, but I think of that as a program, at minimum being akin to the data parsers that have grown so popular. That's what I'd call a tool. As for controllers, keyboards, and mice, I wouldn't say so. After all, that'd be ridiculous. This game will end up on the PS3. Does a Sony controller fall under this category? "Using third party programs or tools in FINAL FANTASY XIV is strictly prohibited since they allow users to gain an unfair advantage over other players." If you claim a controller is a tool, then yes, and I don't see how they plan on pulling that off without being required to punish everyone not using a Square Enix brand controller. Thus it cannot be termed a tool or program as per the first sentence, and as the second says the use of programs or tools to perform continuous actions is referred to as "absentee play," it cannot be considered "absentee play" either.

And this is why care is usually taken when writing all that lawyer mumbo jumbo.

There is no point arguing the matter further.

I was gunning for a dev response, but what is truly needed is either a revision to the rules and policies and/or a revision to the crafting system.

You guys need to read Sherman Antitrust Act (Sherman Act,[1] July 2, 1890, ch. 647, 26 Stat. 209, 15 U.S.C. §§ 1–7) [USA] or Article 101 of the Treaty [EU] and Article 102 of the Treaty [EU]. To understand why there is no definition of terms regarding botting or automation software. And a bit of information for consumers rights. That all I had to say! For now

[TheVedis]

Watching tv while pressing enter and pay attention to the tells, if i dont know the ppl that sends me tells i usually ignore + /blist

and you have every right to, and the main thing to point out in what you said, you CHOOSE to ignore them, thats a powerful word there, it shows you watch whats being said to you, which is how its supposed to be

players have no say in your banning if you are botting after all, its the GMs, and something tells me you would not CHOOSE to ignore and blist them lol


so youd be doing it legit basicaly compared to the people who walk away and ignore their computer, and then use "im watching tv" as an excuse for not seeing the computer, when the fact is they werent even at the computer to begin with(or had the screen minimied which is pretty much the same imo)

[Rydin]

Going from 1 to 50 in a week it is not possible unless they also use exp scrolls and even if they do, I still dont buy that it can be done in a week.

bullshit....

You can spam standard... if its within 5 levels of you, you'll complete 50-60 synths an hour
5 or 6 levels above you and you're getting 30-33k an hour
60*550= 33,000exp per hour
2-3 levels above you and you're getting 20k an hour....
60*350 = 21000exp per hour
there are recipes at every level.
So lets say you could get.. on average 25k an hour.....
thats 72 hours of crafting from 1 - 50
25,000 exp * 72 hours - 1,800,000 exp (Roughly the amount needed from 1 - 50)
10 hours and 17 minutes a day of crafting will be equal to 72 hours in a weeks time

10 hours of gameplay a day indicates you have little to no life... but you're hardly a bot
and it's very doable

And honestly.... If it isn't your "FIRST" 50, then you probably do have enough money to buy all the mats and shards (IF you dont already have them) that you need to do the whole thing... so yes... 1-50 crafting is very possible in a week

Lets say you had to farm your own mats.... and played 16 hours a day... (It sounds extreme but yes.. people do this legitimately)
You could still do it in a week if you really researched what synths were the best for each level....
The best I could do was level 30-50 in 8-10 days... with no scrolls.. because I am too cheap to buy all the mats

so youd be doing it legit basicaly compared to the people who walk away and ignore their computer, and then use "im watching tv" as an excuse for not seeing the computer, when the fact is they werent even at the computer to begin with(or had the screen minimied which is pretty much the same imo)

Dual monitors for the win

[Riv]

Imo it's SE's fault for creating a system that lets you repeat the entire crafting process from start to finish by only pressing one button.

Need to change the UI, so you have to actually look at the screen to confirm something. For example you could make the default selection = cancel instead of accept.

So the next bot will have a command to move the cursor down before hitting OK. You've just solved world hunger.

They need to make crafting "fun". It does nothing right but but wear out the confirm button on my controller.

[DardGhalawad]

Quote Originally Posted by DardGhalawad View Post
Watching tv while pressing enter and pay attention to the tells, if i dont know the ppl that sends me tells i usually ignore + /blist
and you have every right to, and the main thing to point out in what you said, you CHOOSE to ignore them, thats a powerful word there, it shows you watch whats being said to you, which is how its supposed to be

players have no say in your banning if you are botting after all, its the GMs, and something tells me you would not CHOOSE to ignore and blist them lol


so youd be doing it legit basicaly compared to the people who walk away and ignore their computer, and then use "im watching tv" as an excuse for not seeing the computer, when the fact is they werent even at the computer to begin with(or had the screen minimied which is pretty much the same imo)

"minimized"* (I could go on from the first word to the last but ... lol... I'm not your grammer teacher!)

I dont watch tv while I play lol, if you didn´t notice in the part " watching tv..." (sarcasm on my part, on wich I forgot to add ""), was taked from your own post. Because dont you consider yourself legit? Then why you watch tv while you play?
I'm free to ignore (something similar to the last word said) "witch hunters" (what a joker is) and to blist them, just because they annoy me with the limited knowledge and limited assumptions they make!
And indirect accusations based on the limited knowledge/assumptions and low base interpretation on international laws of consume and consumer rights, just reflects the same thing has this thread. It's a MINDLESS thread leaded by MINDLESS people.
Wich no matter how many times I read the forums rules, I still see repeated threads with the same "mambo-jambo, yaddy-yaddy, me me me "points" them them them".
Then why I shouldn't be mad about people that just shows up from no where and send me a /tell asking if I'm there (here)?
Also the fast reply done in just less than 3m was amazing! (this time I didn't forget it).Was because of the fact that the lower text after "watching tv..." was to much hard to interpret? Stop "looking" for "witches" where are any! It just degrades your ""legit" status Quo".

[TheVedis]

"minimized"* (I could go on from the first word to the last but ... lol... I'm not your grammer teacher!)

I dont watch tv while I play lol, if you didn´t notice in the part " watching tv..." (sarcasm on my part, on wich I forgot to add ""), was taked from your own post. Because dont you consider yourself legit? Then why you watch tv while you play?
I'm free to ignore (something similar to the last word said) "witch hunters" (what a joker is) and to blist them, just because they annoy me with the limited knowledge and limited assumptions they make!
And indirect accusations based on the limited knowledge/assumptions and low base interpretation on international laws of consume and consumer rights, just reflects the same thing has this thread. It's a MINDLESS thread leaded by MINDLESS people.
Wich no matter how many times I read the forums rules, I still see repeated threads with the same "mambo-jambo, yaddy-yaddy, me me me "points" them them them".
Then why I shouldn't be mad about people that just shows up from no where and send me a /tell asking if I'm there (here)?
Also the fast reply done in just less than 3m was amazing! (this time I didn't forget it).Was because of the fact that the lower text after "watching tv..." was to much hard to interpret? Stop "looking" for "witches" where are any! It just degrades your ""legit" status Quo".

yeah players have no say in wether or not your a bot, they dont need reasons to report you

but a bot is a player who is automated in the end, playing while afk(not at computer or having a control do it for them etc etc)

watching tv isnt one of these things, but using it as an excuse to not respond to ANYTHING AT ALL is unfortunately not a good reason if you get banned for it, they wont accept that obviously


and i use the watching tv thing as an example cuz we all do it in some form or another, hell you can do it while fighting, gathering, anything, you dont need a turbo control, or to even be crafting to watch tv on the side




in the end though players have no say in who gets banned, and in determining who is a bot or not(besides maybe reporting people, but reporting does not mean they are actualy bots, the player doesnt get to decide that, and this fact is lost on alot of people)
the people you will care about messaging you are actual GMs, and you will know who they are, they wont hide it from you, and as i said, im sure youll respond to them


also how the hell am i lookin for witches lol, i dont think you understand my stance on all this
im against witch hunts, but facts are facts


if you cant respond to a gm cuz you arent paying attention, you obviously are botting
if you are just ignoring people cuz you dont want to respond to them, all the more power to you(you have the ability to respond to GMs still in this case, since they are the only ones you need to respond to if contacted)