Red Mages need some love

[Malkria]

LOL.

I’m sorry, I neither know nor care who you are, nor do I care about your attention. You can tell yourself whatever you need to in order to sleep at night, but I could not care less. I do care about people who come into arguments trying to pass off anecdotes as facts, though.

And I do thank you for my evening laugh.

You have no answers for the questions posed to you, and you're hurting since the real world disagrees with your echo chamber. Sorry, that's life. You're wrong regarding your posts, your evidence is lackluster at best, and you're resorting to ad hominem. Log back in, unequip the Black Mage stone and play something you want to play instead of whining about playstyles your echo chamber doesn't like.

So says the two people taking a single paragraph and chopping it up line by line. If that isn't a desperate cry for attention, then it's a pathetic way to conduct a debate. Like I said, I have better things to do then continue on with you two, because when you do stupid stuff like that? I don't even bother reading it, it's just a very obvious que that my time is better spent elsewhere from two people who can't formulate a response to a single paragraph. That chances are whatever you did say probably wasn't worth the effort to read.

So cheers, reply to this (I know you will) but I won't know about it, and have fun with the last word mates! ^.^

[Dualgunner]

snip

A pathetic way to conduct a debate by responding point-by-point to somebody? Okay sure, I guess in your world where 3 year old <3000 response polls beat out data collected over a whole tier and 50 anecdotes constitutes good evidence, I can see that. But since you have such an issue, I snipped your response.

Continue to enjoy thinking you're the better man by trying to back out of this debate, despite the fact that everyone reading can see quite clearly you're only quitting because you have no real answers to the queries and critiques of your positions we've given you. Go spend your time better elsewhere, champ.

[HyoMinPark]

So says the two people taking a single paragraph and chopping it up line by line. If that isn't a desperate cry for attention, then it's a pathetic way to conduct a debate. Like I said, I have better things to do then continue on with you two, because when you do stupid stuff like that? I don't even bother reading it, it's just a very obvious cue* that my time is better spent elsewhere from two people who can't formulate a response to a single paragraph. That chances are whatever you did say probably wasn't worth the effort to read.

That’s how I normally respond to posts? I’m sorry that my post style doesn’t cater to what you would prefer. It’s so people can easily follow my replies to multiple points in their post, rather than have it all lumped into one wall of text. That doesn’t immediately invalidate responses, nor is it some supposed cry for some rando online’s attention. I’m sorry to say.

Actually, a lot of forum posters respond in this fashion, so I suppose you’ll be in for a lot of ignoring in future debates. Probably for the best though. Especially since you prefer to respond to debates with outdated polls, anecdotal evidence, ad hominem, and responses such as these:

That chances are whatever you did say probably wasn't worth the effort to read.

I mean when people start chopping up your post into line by line responses you know they are just getting desperate for attention from you. I guess that means those two 'win' the argument, but hey I like letting people feel good about themselves once in awhile. These two probably needed a win of some sort in their lives somehow.

Instead of, you know, responding to the debate at hand.

[EllieShadeflare]

Honestly, I feel that the Dualcast effect could be changed in a similar way to how Lightspeed gives "instant" casts, by making the next spell have something like -5s to their cast time. Heck, the way Verraise works versus other Raise spells seems to support this idea, since Resurrection, Raise, and Ascend have 8s versus the base 10s of Verraise... and doing this change would make Verraise raise as quickly as Lightspeed'd Ascend, while not affecting the internal balance of Red Mage's rotation.

After the psuedo-nerf to Verraise, we can then focus on either boosting the potency of Embolden or boosting the potency of their spells/melee combo. Maybe even replace Tether with an actual buff. I'unno.

[Remedi]

Mh good call actually, that does idd feels interesting

[Maero]

You see more Red Mages because blm are the ones raiding.
There is literally nothing Red Mage brings to a raid if you are to choose between it or smn and blm

[Singularity]

You see more Red Mages because blm are the ones raiding.
There is literally nothing Red Mage brings to a raid if you are to choose between it or smn and blm

It brings fun to those that enjoy playing it. People often speak in these threads like almost every raid group is composed of bleeding-edge omniclass speed runners who dispassionately choose their job based on efficiency alone. In fact only very few groups operate this way, you don't have to go very far down even the fastest clears on FFlogs (within the top 20, top 10 even in some cases) before you find jobs that would be considered less efficient than others in the same role.

Also, on topic, I'd prefer to see Manafication become "your next three enchanted weaponskills cost no mana". That would fix all of its "not a good time for this" issues, particularly alignment with Trick Attack during the opener.

[Maero]

It brings fun to those that enjoy playing it. People often speak in these threads like almost every raid group is composed of bleeding-edge omniclass speed runners who dispassionately choose their job based on efficiency alone. In fact only very few groups operate this way, you don't have to go very far down even the fastest clears on FFlogs (within the top 20, top 10 even in some cases) before you find jobs that would be considered less efficient than others in the same role.

Our group had 3 Red Mages (myself included) and i had to go as Nin, the other 2 are now smn and blm in our group. You are not understanding the point that i made that Red Mage does not bring utility like that of say smn and Bard and is even behind on damage. This is the whole premise of the thread really in which many of us want changes to the job.

Also Red Mage is now the only job that has not seen any changes, this far into the expansion really SE?

[Singularity]

Our group had 3 Red Mages (myself included) and i had to go as Nin, the other 2 are now smn and blm in our group. You are not understanding the point that i made that Red Mage does not bring utility like that of say smn and Bard and is even behind on damage. This is the whole premise of the thread really in which many of us want changes to the job.

Also Red Mage is now the only job that has not seen any changes, this far into the expansion really SE?

Oh don't get me wrong, I understand the utility/damage issue. Just that your post was worded as though you wouldn't expect to see a RDM in a raid group, whereas in fact the vast majority of groups are not nearly so meta-strict and personal preference plays a greater role in what job one plays.

[Maero]

Oh don't get me wrong, I understand the utility/damage issue. Just that your post was worded as though you wouldn't expect to see a RDM in a raid group, whereas in fact the vast majority of groups are not nearly so meta-strict and personal preference plays a greater role in what job one plays.

Fair enough, thank you for explaining

All content is clearable in all jobs really just other jobs are picked in groups over ones that do less damage and utility not worth mentioning.
And it is sad that SE think buffing RM will make it so that all jobs will then not be balanced?
How is it that jobs that offer far more raid support and out damage you balanced then? lol

It got one change. A bug fix which works out to be a bit of a shadow nerf lol.

Yeah that makes me wish they did not fix it, we would then possibly be on par with all the other jobs as of now