Thread: 4.3 AST changes/speculations

Idk I just feel like in this situation SCH is like WAR and AST is like DRK, both arnt bad but both need some serious class adjustments to be more on level with it's counterparts

Unfortunately I feel like sch will always be OP and broken as it was in HW there's no way around it so at least makes some QoL to noct

Originally Posted by AmurT

I'm kind of fine with how Minor Arcana is, it's not supposed to be something you rely on, just a better alternative to simply undrawing a card. But perhaps they'll add more cards to it in the future like "The Knave of Crowns", since that is also one of the 3 faces of Minor Arcana according to the lore book. Or maybe change the effects of Lord and Lady depending on which card is sacrificed? The Minor Arcana we currently have are based on "The Crown" which belongs to Spire's suit, maybe if we sacrifice a Balance, we could get a Lord/Lady from "The Staves" suit? I think it will be unlikely, too many cards, but it's fun to think of.

But new instant GCD is very much needed as well as changes to the leveling of AST. You only have 2 DPS skills before level 52 and low level roulette with AST are so boring. I often refer to AST as being the most boring low level job.

Tanks still think AST's are WHM's and run off expecting benediction with a wall-to-wall pull. AST's do not have Assize, they have Earthly star, and Earthly star does not recover MP. Hoping for the Ewer card is relying on RNGesus.

The easiest tweak AST could get is to move Gravity to the same level slot as Holy and add a debuff like heavy or bind to it.

The Minor Arcana seems like yet another RNGesus thing that can't be relied on.

I think SE should just give up on the RNG aspect of AST and instead have a perpetual "set it and forget it" card buff going.

Step 1. Draw a card (0.5x, 1.0x, 1.5x, 2.0x),
Step 2. Place them on Balance (ATK PWR), Bole (DEF), Arrow (SPD), Spear (CRIT), Ewer (MP), Spire (TP)) slots. Optionally Place them on Lord/Lady of Crowns slots.
Step 3. Buff stays until replaced, or until AST is knocked out. Total Power of cards placed can not exceed 2.0. Placing a second 2.0 card removes all other cards placed except Crowns
CD applies to the specific buff, so once removed it can't be put back until the CD resets.

So this is moving the RNG to be more inline with how RNG works for crit rather than the buff itself being the RNG.

The problem with combining MP and TP in order to give Spire a valid use, is that it then makes Ewer and Spire too valuable to Royal Road.
Having Spire as a throwaway card for Royal Road is incredibly useful.

The only card I never like getting is the Bole.
A healer can't rely on RNG for it's healing or mitigation, as such you will always plan your moves without taking Bole into account and when you do get it it's not needed.
Then again, like Spire, I occasionally Royal Road it when I've already got a Balance held, but it's far less useful than Spire.

I think taking your idea in a slightly different direction, is rather see this:

Ewer: Bestows a weak HoT
Spire: MP and TP regen

Spire then becomes the new Ewer (purely for thematic reasons)

Whole Ewer fits a new sporadic use niche with Bole.
Bole serves as: shield while in diurnal, otherwise RR for 200% effect.
Ewer serves as: HoT while in nocturnal, otherwise RR for 50% AoE

Which I think carries on the sect duality nicely.

Originally Posted by AmurT

That's a nice idea. I always did wonder why Gravity was essentially a worse version of Holy with less damage, targetting placement and no debuff.

Although, I have to say I'm fine with the RNG aspect of card drawing - it also fits with the lore and how tarot readings in general are complete RNG (some people even enjoy the RNG factor). When I get into bad parties, it's nice to suddenly draw a Bole or double Ewers, but the issue is those cards are only applicable in those situations.

I'm just worried that the RNG aspect makes players playing AST completely ignore the cards and 8 slots on their hotbars it takes up to deal with. Like below level 30 you don't even have the cards, so you're basically a baby-whm (Benefic II at level 26, where as WHM gets Cure II at 30, but gets Repose at 26.)

The fact that CNJ/WHM and THM/BLM are the only ones with Repose/Sleep, makes using it useless in all duties except Brayflox Longstop. Like I'm not sure what SE was expecting here. I've seen THM's try to use it in Sastasha, Copperbell and Halitali, but it really doesn't do anything in those, since other players just hit all the mobs at random. AST and SCH don't have them, so no content can ever be designed with "sleep" as a possible way to control the fight. WHM has Holy which is more useful for the stun effect than any damage it creates, since it resets all the mobs actions, thus making it easier to avoid their AOE's since they all appear at the same time. Gravity really needs to be at the same level (eg 42) since they have the same potency, but Gravity really needs Heavy or Bind to make it useful for crowd control beyond just being another AOE to throw at a group of mobs. SCH does not have a crowd-control skill at all.

Like I really don't care for "zerg"'ing dungeons, to begin with, but AST just ends up being slower to play, and slower to have in the party as the ideal card setup pre-pull is slow. I find it's more fun to play on the level 60 raids and level 60-70 Trials, but otherwise the lack of a AOE in all the level 50 and below dungeons makes it feel like you're the one slowing things down.

Something else SE could try is to remove the CD from all the card CD's when not engaged in a fight (eg allow draw/undraw/redraw with no CD.) That would speed things up a bit, particularly on Alliance raids where often there IS enough time to draw two cards, but not enough time to draw a second card once the fight begins.

Just on the the topic of AST identity, I wouldn't mind if AST became either a HoT style healer or a Shield style healer. In terms of raw value AST shields already outdo SCHs and Diurnal Aspected Benefic already out heals Regen, doubling down on either aspect (no pun intend) and remove the other role would at least allow for more healer styles in the future / easier to balance healers. I wouldn't even mind seeing a slightly higher potency value come out of AST but they lose all the frills (HoTs / Shields) of their heals so it's a very bread and butter heal with a heavy focus on the support aspect it provides and just build around that. To compliment that, they could make Dirunal Sect and Nocturnal Sect buffs that are mutually exclusive / shared CD of one minute CD. Have Dirunal provide a Refresh effect and Nocturnal provide a healing potency buff to help with AST HPS sustain.

Let's see....

-Would love if CU had a shorter recast instead of 90 it should be 70 or 60 sec..
-Being able to use lightspeed + attack abilities
-How about earthly star recover 5 - 8% of MP since it does have a pretty short recast similar to assize I guess sorry I'm not creative lol
-Noct stance ?????? Not sure about to make it better heh Lol
-I agree with others saying we should have Stella back.

Originally Posted by MysticDreamer

Let's see....

-Would love if CU had a shorter recast instead of 90 it should be 70 or 60 sec..
-Being able to use lightspeed + attack abilities
-How about earthly star recover 5 - 8% of MP since it does have a pretty short recast similar to assize I guess sorry I'm not creative lol
-Noct stance ?????? Not sure about to make it better heh Lol
-I agree with others saying we should have Stella back.

CU being changed to 60s is tricky. It's incredibly strong afterall. Instead, maybe change Celestial Opposition to 90s so it alligns better with CU.

A "Fickle Twilight" Ability would nice. Something that allows you to cast your next healing spell as if you were in the opposite stance with reduced cast time. Adding an instant group regen or shield occasionally would definitely help when your cohealer dies and all your big abilities are on cool down. It would be like the Scholar's Emergency Tactics and allow them to put a major shield up with Aspected Benefic in both stances or a strong regen behind a powerful shield. It would be MP intense but give them the clutch save they need between uses of Collective and Earthly Star.