All Greed on Alliance loot

[KisaiTenshi]

I don't understand what problem this is meant to solve. Like, doing this on the card/orchestron drops? Sure. People wind up needing those anyway because it doesn't make sense to do anything else, so making those have a single option will just help newbies who don't realize they shouldn't greed it. That change would make sense.

But on gear? Why? Just... WHY? Without any rationale into what they're thinking in doing this, it's utterly baffling and seems like someone making arbitrary changes just to screw with us.

My guess is this was lost in translation, I watched live letter from roughly the point they started talking about the new raids and didn't see it, but then again, they weren't translating what was actually being said, only the text on the slides.

The only mention I see of -all greed- comes from what looks like discord.


(screenshot comes from mr.happy's video https://youtu.be/41n4Rx88Ksg?t=517 )

[Fyce]

Glamour? Use for later when they may (or may not ) need it. I mean if you dont want to run this often per week some might just roll on something to get it. Even if its just something for a job that is not really used that much.

And it will get worse for those that want it for glamour later and the weekly lock out is removed..

That can already happen with the current system. And I think you are overestimating the number of people who'd burn their weekly lockout on something they can't even use. It'll be an exception, not the rule.

I think that, on average, you'll compete against 0 to 4 people max, depending on the piece (a pair of boots for DRG will obviously be less popular than a chest piece for healer, for example).

[BillyKaplan]

And I think you are overestimating the number of people who'd burn their weekly lockout on something they can't even use.

You run the raid the once a week for the upgrade item. You don't need anything for the job you're running because you either run Savage or you just got tomes gear, but your alt job is ALMOST up there, and that glamour looks sick and you really want it. You have nothing else to spend that weekly gear roll on so you roll if on that glamour bait and you get it. Alternatively, it's your 20th run this week and you're so very tired so you roll on something that might as well be nice glamour if it already dropped and lo and behold, you got it so you're free until the reset. Content burnout is a real concern you're ignoring.
Neither scenario is as rare or unthinkable as you think it is, the difference is that until now if I wanted a tank piece I'd be blocked by the tank actually rolling Need on it, but now my 99 Greed roll is going to beat the person who for all intents and purposes could've MT'd the entire raid and saved our collective butts.

[InkstainedGwyn]

That can already happen with the current system. And I think you are overestimating the number of people who'd burn their weekly lockout on something they can't even use. It'll be an exception, not the rule.

I think that, on average, you'll compete against 0 to 4 people max, depending on the piece (a pair of boots for DRG will obviously be less popular than a chest piece for healer, for example).

Every single thread I ever saw about people wanting "need" removed (or, opposite, people being banned for rolling on anything they can't use) had a good 1/4+ of the posters saying "I need every time I can need because I want seals and desynth." Now that they can't need it, they'll greed more. Especially if they already have better gear and are just in it for the upgrade token.

Is it going to happen every time? No. Will it happen enough that it, +RNG, are going to screw a lot of people over? Yes.

[Ariane]

That can already happen with the current system. And I think you are overestimating the number of people who'd burn their weekly lockout on something they can't even use. It'll be an exception, not the rule.

I think that, on average, you'll compete against 0 to 4 people max, depending on the piece (a pair of boots for DRG will obviously be less popular than a chest piece for healer, for example).

So what you are saying is that a DRG main not only gets equal chance to getting that highly in demand healer gear, he still basically gets to keep getting his DRG glamour with little to no competition if that DRG gear drops instead? And this is suppose to balanced?

[TheAngelneer]

Current situation:
- Tanks have to roll against 0 other player.
- Healers have to roll against 1 other player.
- DPS roll against 0 to 4 other players depending on what other jobs are in the party. DRG and NIN need to be matched with the exact same job for that to happen, while caster DPS share gear with 2 other jobs which increase the chances of them getting matched with a player who can compete with them.

New situation:
- The number of people you roll against only depend on what people want to roll on, regardless of jobs/roles.
And contrary to what some people are saying, rolling against the full 7 other players for a specific piece of gear will be very rare.

That's the only thing I see that get solved with this new system.[/SIZE]

And now everyone has to roll against 0 to 7 people depending on what they are looking for. If there are DPS sharing roles they are in a worst position now because they no longer only compete among themselves.

In the end it is worse for everyone, how can you claim it is solving anything? I wouldn't call putting everyone in the same miserable boat "making things fair".

[Tridus]

My guess is this was lost in translation, I watched live letter from roughly the point they started talking about the new raids and didn't see it, but then again, they weren't translating what was actually being said, only the text on the slides.

The only mention I see of -all greed- comes from what looks like discord.


(screenshot comes from mr.happy's video https://youtu.be/41n4Rx88Ksg?t=517 )

That's something, thanks. This highlights a big problem with this method of spreading information: what you get depends on which fan site you're looking at. They're not all saying the same things.

Anyway, at least that is a reason, but it's not a good one IMO. Someone actually doing a job and seeing an upgrade should be able to need it over someone who just wants stuff for something they might never play. That's been standard MMO etiquette for a very, very long time. You can't even turn the current alliance stuff in for seals/desynth, so it's not exactly hard to build a greed set. Especially once the lockouts are lifted. That's exactly how I got both DPS and tank gear out of there: on my healers who didn't need much of anything.

But now? I'll feel pretty bad if some RDM main loses an upgrade to me when it's something I play as a secondary thing.

[MrSmiley]

After the weekly lock out is done, and in old raids, this will be terrible. People will roll greed just because they can, like they do everywhere else. I loved the alliance roulette and regularly queue old races as a class I desire the glamour for. Es ecpecially int he old ones where the bosses drop only a single item for 8 people.... this will kill that. I won't be running the old alliance anymore at all because it won't be worth the headache.

During weekly lockout I don't think it will matter much but after that is gone...lol. RIP alliance raids for me.

[Tridus]

- The number of people you roll against only depend on what people want to roll on, regardless of jobs/roles.
And contrary to what some people are saying, rolling against the full 7 other players for a specific piece of gear will be very rare.

While that makes sense, it now opens up the situation of a caster now has to role against a healer (aka: me) on caster gear because I want it for a secondary job, whereas it might be an upgrade for their main. If the itemization in the new one is the same as Rab, I will be healing it and rolling on exactly zero pieces of healer gear. They've now turned me into competition with casters (and tanks because I have PLD) when I wasn't before.

Thats the downside to this. I can take upgrades for a main because I want them for a secondary job. That's not something I want to do. An awful lot of years of ingrained MMO etiquette says that's bad, and I'd feel bad if it happened. But they've removed the means we have to avoid it except someone asking "please don't roll on the paints, they're an upgrade", others having to remember that.

[Dragon_punch]

I feel like this could have been easily fixed with a token system. In-fact even the older 24-man raids could use a token system for those glamour hunting.