Eureka's Identiy vs Reality w/ Suggestions

[Ayirez]

Introduction

Strap in lads and lassies for I have much to say. I am a level 20 WHM (Since Healers are always needed in Eureka) and have finished my MNK and WAR weapon and armor sets, so I have a tad bit of experience with Eureka and its mechanics. I am also a game developer myself, took years of college for it and while I lack a finished product it at least is innovative and fun (subjectively between myself and play testing friends) so I hope my insight is somewhat valid. Let me be frank, I do not enjoy Eureka. The concepts and foundations are GOOD, but that is all they are. Imagine you were going to create a cat out of thin air (You're a god(ess) and are bored and cats are awesome), Eureka would be the product of making the skeleton of a cat and forgetting all the meat and cute and fluffy fur that makes a cat good.

So, with that said, I want to run over a few things for you, the game developers and SE themselves, and any players who want to read awhile and perhaps give their own opinions and takes and ideas on the matter. I will start with the main concept of Eureka and work my way through things that should have branched off from it.

Eureka and the Six Elements

For all those who have played FFXIV for years you will recognize the six elements; Lightning, Fire, Water, Ice, Earth, and Wind. This is the core mechanic and idea behind Eureka; "Utilize these to have a fun and rewarding experience". Perhaps the devs forgot the fun aspect of it however and so we've been left with a very simple and the illusion of choice that is the Magia Board. To point out the flaw of this system is also rather simple and easy to do and that is its rock paper scissors mechanic. Of course, when you think of elements you think of it, you think of "Water douses Fire, so Fire is weak against Water!". In a game like Pokemon this works, but in a game like FFXIV, and indeed in this capacity, it does not.

The reason the Magia Board is an illusion of choice is due to how roles in an MMO work. If you're a tank you will need to take hits, as all mobs are of a single element the tank will want to stack all their Magicite points into one column and have it set to the same element as the mob. On the other hand there is DPS whose sole focus is to deal damage, thus they do exactly the same and stack all Magicite points into one column but instead set it to that elements weakness. Finally you have the healer role and while the option of choice does exist for them it is between only the two above, stack all their Magicite points into one column and adjust based on what they feel like doing, Living through mechanics or DPSing. This is not a fun system and is more of a chore than an in-depth and interesting thing to focus on.

Rather than focus on Magicite points giving an offensive edge against elements it should focus on defending against them instead. If they were utilized solely for defence it would force the player to adjust against mobs who would otherwise kill them. However this doesn't solve the problem of it being a boring system in which you stack all points into one column, and here is the solution; Instead of having mobs that simply auto-attack and use a single (sometimes two) ability(ies) as a soft curve-ball to players, giving them three to four abilities of varying elements to make combos with will allow for more strategy to be involved when engaging and fighting them. For instance, if a mob is of the Lightning element its auto-attacks should deal damage in Lightning, it should have one to two abilities that are Lightning-based while the other two abilities are of the Wind and Fire elements, the elements that it resides beside on the Magia Board. As a side note, it would be important to have these abilities synergize with one another, similar to how the level ~8 ice imps cast heavy on a player and then use an AoE centered on them. Combos like that are fun and interesting.

If one were to stack all their points into a single column being hit by these "off-element" abilities could prove fatal. Some mobs could even have forced hit "off-element" abilities (such as raid-wide AoEs) thus making it rather mandatory. This wouldn't completely solve the Magia Board's issue, but it would allow for more strategic use of your Magicite points based on the mob you're facing. For instance, if it only has one Lightning ability and it's easy to dodge, DPS could prioritize their "off-element" defences instead, stacking them where needed based on personal choice. Tanks would want to focus on the main element with more mild defences against the "off-element" abilities, but with some wiggle room of choice as to which ones they would rather defend more against. Players would need to be given the ability to change their Magicite points more often however, and if on the fly changing isn't an option perhaps more Magia Board "stations" could be placed around the map in places it would make sense for them to exist (old torn down cabins, etc).

This still however doesn't address the issue of the Magia Board being rather stagnant in terms of when you rotate it. In this next section I will go over what should have been for an island where the "elements are in flux".

Elemental Weather

Indeed, currently weather plays a small role in certain mechanics, such as Gales being needed to spawn Jahannam and Pazuzu, but aside from that is more of a simple make in that it spawns certain enemies that serve no real purpose aside from getting in the way and cluttering certain areas that already have mobs. Rain is by far the worst as it spawns annoying Water Sprites that overlap otherwise navigable mobs (Though at level 20 this becomes a non-issue). Weather as it is simply plays no real role in the Eurekan experience, but it doesn't have to be that way.

A lofty goal I'm sure and perhaps a rather difficult one to program given FFXIV's spaghetti code, if weather were to change the elemental affinities of ALL mobs across the island based on what their normal element is, this would allow for on the go rotations of the Magia Board to become a necessity. Furthermore, if the weather cycle were to be sped up to a single Eorzean hour (2 minutes and 55 seconds) this would create a much more interesting use of the Magia Board. More weather types would also be required, such as Heat Waves, Dust Storms, etc to allow the Elemental changes to cover all six elements, not just Water/Ice/Wind ones. Obviously more charges and faster regeneration of charges would be needed in order to accompany the change, but it would be fun and an important factor consistently within Eureka. The way in which the weather changes a mob would be based on their core affinity vs the weather's affinity and finding the middle ground.

Let's look at an example of how this would work. You and friends are fighting a Squib of Water affinity while it is clear weather. Suddenly the weather changes to rain/showers and...! It's still water, phew. But after a few more Squib take-downs the weather changes once again, this time to heat stroke. The Squib would then change, going toward the middle ground of the two elements, yet as they are side by side on the Magia Board it simply makes the transition to Fire instead. Now an angry hot Squib is tearing up the tank and shoots lightning at a DPS, both who didn't change their Magia Boards and are now tanking the floor. After recovering and fighting fire Squibs for awhile the weather changes again, this time to dust storms. As Earth and Water are not side by side the transition would change them instead into Ice Squibs.

As you can see, this would be a much more in-depth use of the weather and elements. If the element of the weather and mob are opposites (for instance if the core affinity of the mob is Water and the weather turns to Gales) there are two choices; A) The mob does not change at all due to opposites being incompatible or B) The mob transitions to one of the two elements closer to its own affinity at random. This would allow for less work on the Devs as less assets would be needed for each mob than if you were to add two more. Regardless, with all change more assets would be needed and would take time to do, even if 18 months is what it takes.

Finally we move to the last core feature that would spice up the Eurekan experience to create a more fun and lively environment.

Magia Board Bonuses

While prior to this I said that the Magia Board shouldn't Focus on giving Players an offensive edge against mobs it was a half-truth. While the Elements shouldn't have weaknesses in the traditional sense, that doesn't mean the player can't be powered up through the elements that they have chosen. What I would suggest then is not buffs to raw power, but buffs to substats instead based on the amount of Magicite Points in any given Element. For instance, Lightning is destructive and strikes with ferocity, therefore if it gave a +10% bonus to Critical Hit and Direct Hit that would make sense. Fire on the other hand is similar but not the same, causing raw destruction over a span of time, thus giving a +5% bonus to Critical Hit while also giving a +10% bonus to Skill Speed and Spell Speed to power up DoT abilities would make sense. Water is known for being an element of life and rejuvenation, giving the Player +50% HP Regeneration and MP Regeneration in-combat would then be a neat way to play off its identity.

These bonuses could and should definitely fall off the more points you put into any given element, otherwise stacking would again become extremely popular, but it also creates an environment where depending on the elemental affinity of your enemy you too change and adapt in a small but important way. Honestly, Eureka seems to have forgot its Identity. While it is the bare bones of a fluffy and glorious cat, it simple stopped at the bones and crammed everything together as is, falling short of what it could have been; a fun and enjoyable experience for all.

Thanks for reading, and by no means are these all my ideas or suggestions, but simply the ones based around the core identity of the island and the elemental flux it is supposed to have.

tl;dr

- Elements shouldn't be weak to one another but instead have the player focus on defending against them, while giving enemies varied elemental attacks based on their elemental affinity and the two elements on either side of it on the Magia Board. This would create an environment in which stacking Magicite points would no longer be the only "choice" players need to make.

- Weather should play a major role in mechanics with more weather types added while changing the elemental affinities of mobs based on a "meeting in the middle" arrangement based on the Magia Board. More rotation charges should be given to the player with a higher regeneration rate as well as specific sites across the island to reallocate and recharge your Magia Board.

- The Magia Board should give "offensive" bonuses, but rather than being based on a weakness system or one wherein you focus all your Magicite Points into one element it should instead focus on giving the players substats that match the identity of the element in question. These points should have a dramatic fall off to prevent stacking for offensive purposes.

[Pastahnak]

Couple things I don't agree with and that'd be the rapid weather cycle and bringing in heat stroke/sandstorms just because I think they plan on adding to eureka with zones that would feature that. But besides that 100% yes please.

Magia board is so dull right now I usually forget to spin it when in the train or grinding. This idea would finally make those spin left/right macros worth it :P

As someone who likes eureka I also have to agree with your analogy of it, a skeleton of a cat isn't what makes the cat cute and adorable, but it is something to build off of and I'm hopeful that they'll be adding more and varied content later down the line either in anemos itself or in a whole new zone.

[Dzian]

The magia systems biggest flaw is it's choices are worthless and have no meaning.

You can chop and change your points so easily it takes away all meaning.. If you were to completely remove the magia bored the gameplay within eureka would not change in the slightest.

You've put all your points in wind and move to jobs resistant to it. No problem just change your points to another element. It is at best a minor inconvenience to change. But it doesnt change gamepkag at all.

If you've put all your points in wind that is where they should stay. If your target is resistant you then have to adapt a different strategy and change your gameplay to overcome it. That would be interesting and would add meaning to your choices and the system

But when you can just change to whatever the target is weak to at will. It becomes a worthless system entirely. And eureka wouldn't change If It was removed.

[Shurrikhan]

The magia systems biggest flaw is it's choices are worthless and have no meaning.

You can chop and change your points so easily it takes away all meaning.. If you were to completely remove the magia bored the gameplay within eureka would not change in the slightest.

You've put all your points in wind and move to jobs resistant to it. No problem just change your points to another element. It is at best a minor inconvenience to change. But it doesnt change gamepkag at all.

If you've put all your points in wind that is where they should stay. If your target is resistant you then have to adapt a different strategy and change your gameplay to overcome it. That would be interesting and would add meaning to your choices and the system

But when you can just change to whatever the target is weak to at will. It becomes a worthless system entirely. And eureka wouldn't change If It was removed.

It would deny the choice between defensive and offensive bonuses, and would remove the bonus of having mob types 2 turns apart (such that your bonus defense to one is bonus damage to the other), any threat of any other form of mixed mob types in the future.

Alternatively, if point choices were permanent they would quickly become community enforced because there will end up being an optimal or standard path -- the latter often optimal simply because it has the largest player population. Unless scaling is vastly improved upon, mob types of any given choice too quickly exhaust themselves to allow the whole or even any large section of the population to play together (which may itself feel more a problem than a benefit which allows for freedom of choice), and NM experience is crippled, the choice likely will go from one of two to one of one. The only way to avoid this would be for the entire idea of elemental bonuses to be reworked from resistance and bypass to something more versatile, such as potency, (re)cast rates, (magic) defense, etc., and/or the opportunity for elementally derived procedurals and effects. At that point it's still nothing one must negotiate as it is now, and does enforce further specialization (especially for tanks), but at least it allows for further character customization within Eureka by which to offset the limiting i300 sync.

[Ayirez]

Last time I covered how the Magia Board could be better utilized and create an interesting and fun atmosphere using it. This time I want to amalgamate some ideas that I've built off one another in other threads and on discord.

Notorious Monster Tracks vs the Notorious Monster Train

Or NM Tracks for short is an idea I had stemming from the problem known as the NM Train. Currently this train all but ruins the Eurekan experience by gathering up almost the entire community within the instance into one area. While twenty-five to forty percent of players there kill creatures to spawn an NM the rest sit around either talking in shout or simply playing other games/watching shows. This seventy-five to sixty percent of players are dubbed afkers and are commonly despised. The reality of the situation is that a large amount of these players deal next to no damage to the creatures in question, while the rest are indeed simply leeching off other players. Those that can't deal damage however shouldn't be there in the first place, and this is where NM Tracks come in.

I would propose a system wherein to spawn an NM you would first need to locate its tracks, simply put the footprints it leaves behind while wandering Eureka's lands. To begin with the initial track would be a small glimmer in the field, randomly generated in an area where creatures are ±3 levels from its own, the first 5 NM's being guaranteed in only those areas that match its level. Players would need to find this small glimmer and reveal that it is indeed an NM Track.

From here is where things get rather rough for the afkers. investigating the NM Tracks would spawn five creatures of that NM's own level (For instance, Sabotender Corrido is a level one NM and is currently spawned by killing Flowering Sabotender which are level six. In this system it would spawn Flowering Sabotenders that are level one) and reveal a very small area "FATE" in which these creatures would need to be dispatched. Players who contribute to its completion will gain a small exp reward equal to 20% of the actual NM's "FATE".

From here players would need to inspect the NM Tracks closer and reveal the direction of the next set of tracks. A simple direction would be given such as North, South, North-East, West, etc. Players would need to search in the given direction for the next small glimmer that spawns the next "Mini-FATE" which would yield the same reward for contribution and give another direction to follow. In total there would be five NM Tracks leading up to the NM in question, the final glimmer (sixth) found spawning the NM itself. Once the NM is also dispatched it would go on cooldown for two hours before its tracks appear again somewhere in the wilds.

Overall this would mean that players who complete both all five NM Tracks as well as the NM itself gain 200% of the experience that NM's currently have to offer. The benefit to this system is not only that its more engaging, but that players would need to be active to gain the full 200% experience and thus cut down how many players currently afk. Yet, Players could still afk and be set to /follow on one of their friends or party members, and that is where this next system comes into play.

Individual Contribution, the Birth of Merit Points

As the title of this section suggests players would need to prove themselves worthy of the rewards they seek from an NM or "Mini-FATE" along the way. This system was primarily realized in part to combat afkers, but an additional boon is that it would prevent low levels from venturing beyond where they should be.

Simply put, Merit Points work off of the bronze/silver/gold medal system that is currently in play for NM's and FATE's, causing players to actually work to earn the reward and not just relying on their party to make up for their lack of damage or effort. As to how these points work let us look at an example. A level fifteen NM spawns and your party consists of four level seventeens, two level fifteens, and two level fives. Taking the amount of party members into consideration, each player within the party must deal X damage to earn a bronze medal, Y damage to earn a silver medal, and Z damage to earn a gold medal. However, because they are a party they are treated as such, as a single unit. This means that in reality ALL players in the party must reach Z damage for the party to earn a gold medal rating. If even one Player is unable to do so and only manages to deal Y damage and earn a silver medal, ALL players would receive a silver medal rating and would be given the rewards of one.

Initially I suspect, as do many of you I imagine, that this could lead to some major griefing. Yet even if that were to be the case it would only happen once per instance. Even though the community I've seen within instances has been less than appealing to mine eyes, the one thing they all seek is experience (or Pazuzu, a name I've come to hate reading). If someone were to grief in this way I guarantee that they would be kicked from the party and shout chat would be flooded with their name and to not invite them/"I wish we could blacklist them" comments. The way to identify the griefer/afk player would be simple; show the amount of contribution that is being made by each player via a separate charging bar per player based on their merit points. Regardless, The benefits of this system outweigh the negatives. In no way should the bar be set all that high either, overall if the party deals an appropriate amount of damage for the amount of players around it should get the credit it deserves, it is not meant to be a punishing system.

However, as you can imagine this would lead to low level players being undesirable for high level NM's, and thus they would not be invited. While one may think of this as a negative it would actually be a boon, low level players would actually be given something to do rather than just follow the train continually, unable to deal damage or help spawn an NM even if they wanted to.

Another factor to consider is the party size and what this means for contribution. What if a solo player wants to attend the NM? How would they possibly achieve the same amount of damage that a full party can and earn a gold medal? Well, via Merit Points that becomes a somewhat irrelevant way of thinking. In the current way FFXIV Devs have things set up, if your party does all the work and you hit something once you can get full credit, but with Merit Points that simply doesn't exist. Solo players would need to contribute slightly higher (anywhere from one and a half to two times) than what a player in an Full Party would need to achieve for a gold medal (for if the system required all players to deal the same amount of damage it would in fact be beneficial to not be in a party at all). Overall this shouldn't amount to too much work on the solo players part as just like the current NM's and FATE's do, they would adapt their power based on how many players are present in the instance. This also means the required bar to reach for a gold medal is adjust as well. Either way, while it would be beneficial to be in a group, it would not be necessary and would be just as manageable if solo.

tl;dr

- A system dubbed NM Tracks could be introduced wherein players must search and find tracks that are within an area of ±3 levels from the NM's own level and would spawn five enemies to fight in a small FATE-like manner. Dispatching these creatures would yield 20% of the NM's experience and give a direction to search in for the next set of tracks. After players have found and followed five tracks the sixth track would spawn the NM themselves. This system would discourage afkers as being present would allow for 200% of an NM's experience yield to be obtained. The cooldown before an NM appears again would be the same as it is now, upon which its tracks would spawn somewhere in the field again.

- A system dubbed Merit Points could be introduced wherein players must deal damage to the NM or targets equal to an X/Y/Z amount and earning them a bronze/silver/gold medal rating. Players in a party would ALL need to reach this threshold for everyone to get a gold medal, otherwise the lowest within the group sets the bar for the rest of the party. While potentially an issue that could cause griefing, those who do would be swiftly removed from any party and exposed in shout chat. Reporting such players is already an option as it isn't linked to only players on the same world server as you. Either way, solo players and smaller parties would need to contribute slightly more damage to reach a gold medal compared to a full party, else no one would form a party in the first place. This amount would be rather negligible overall and quite possible to obtain even if the group showed up somewhat late to the fight.

[Trensharo]

I resubbed cause I thought this would give me something relaxing to do other than chain running the same instance (since this game completely lacks challenging 4 man content), but it has turned out to be nothing but a huge headache. The average player is off ignoring this and just farming the Tome Gear. I'm simply going to wait for Battle for Azeroth. Pretty sure they won't screw up their Island Expeditions this badly.