The general player base needs to improve

[Jojoya]

We need more FCs and groups focused around teaching with decent, patient people doing the teaching. Actual mentors and not just random people who managed to fulfill the coded requirement to get a special badge.

So then who is responsible for forming and leading these FCs, or spending the time to hold teaching groups?

It's really easy to say "someone should be doing those things as long as that someone isn't me because I'm just here to play.". We're all just here to play.

Not everyone is cut out to be a leader or a teacher. Not everyone is willing to give up part of the time they have available to play to help others.

I do agree with the point about the current mentor system. I blocked invites to the Novice Network because the channel was filled with "mentors" bragging about how awesome they were while ignoring requests for information from the new players they were presumably there to help.

[Maighdlin]

So then who is responsible for forming and leading these FCs, or spending the time to hold teaching groups?

It's really easy to say "someone should be doing those things as long as that someone isn't me because I'm just here to play.". We're all just here to play.

Not everyone is cut out to be a leader or a teacher. Not everyone is willing to give up part of the time they have available to play to help others.

I do agree with the point about the current mentor system. I blocked invites to the Novice Network because the channel was filled with "mentors" bragging about how awesome they were while ignoring requests for information from the new players they were presumably there to help.

Personally, I fully intend to be a mentor in my FC and to anyone I meet once I get up to speed with things.

[thegreatonemal]

This is the problem with gamers of today, instead of figuring it out via trial and error they let someone else tell them how to play their job, aka they go to a guide and do rotations, BIS, what jobs are "meta" what aren't, what's the best for this or that. Millennials tend to rely on guides far too much.

Please mmos relies on guides if you aren't googling a guide for an mmo you are playing your class wrong. thing in most people play this game cuz it has Final fantasy in the name and most games don't require you to goggle how to play it right only mmos do that and they need to stop doing that

[Kyp]

This game needs encounters with dps checks that require ppl to do actual dps. the spread right now is 4-6k, with 6k being top, and 5k being average, check needs to be set at 4k. This needs to be in the MSQ instance too, where a bad dps cant get carried by tank/healer dps

[Bobs]

This is an open discussion about bad play on the NA side of things. Particularly in endgame content.

Currently there just is not enough end game content for the player to want to be; or the justification for "git gud."
Great You got all the gear from Savage, you are i370. So what next? More of the same content. There is no goal after getting the item. To that end all the current content can be done just the same with i350. The drive in other mmo is PvP, "get better or get your stuff taken."

Maybe Eureka will bring back some of the drive needed to get better; but people are already declaring it a dud even before it's out. Other than Eureka the status quo formula is obviously not enough to drive people.

Add: It's not a player problem, it's a development problem.

[MoroMurasaki]

Add: It's not a player problem, it's a development problem.

How do you account for all the people who try hard even after clearing and gearing up through Savage? How about the people who haven't done Savage but still perform well in other content that they do complete?

Your theory is full of holes.

There is plenty to do as you begin to master a class. Today I wasn't sure what I felt like doing and joined a few learning parties for EX primals. Got people clears for Lakshmi, Shinryu and Byakko and got some more tokens in the process.

People can be driven by something other than a carrot on a stick.

[Bobs]

People can be driven by something other than a carrot on a stick.

Maybe you are right and the OPs argument is just incorrect. If it is how you say (most people try)

[AxlStream]

Aaaaand this is going straight into my possible future use of siggys.

Now if could just find AxlStream's original quote and I could get this ball rolling...

Ahem...
Ax gon' give it to ya! http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post4524093

Now for my actual post...

The instances to "git gud" are already in place. The logical progression at level 70 should be Expert Roulettes > 24 Man raids > 8 man raids > EX primals >*Savage > Ultimate. It's just not tight enough in it's difficulty to demand the player to step up all the way from the EX primals step. 3 out of the 4 EX primals we had this expansion are laughing stock. In no way do they prepare you for whatever Savage will bring you.

[MoroMurasaki]

Maybe you are right and the OPs argument is just incorrect. If it is how you say (most people try)

I was kind of waiting for an edit here (since this post ends with a parenthesis and not a period or a sentence at all really) but I never said most players try I said some do outside of your black and white boxes of 'Savage raider' and 'everyone else does nothing'.

I have hardly ever done any Savage (largely just O1S and O2S which is widely regarded as not real Savage) but I have orange parses in Rabanastre and I've outdpsed friends of mine who do raid.

If you see gearing up in Savage as the final goalpost in this game I feel bad for you. There's a ton of stuff to do especially as a casual player. Arguing people aren't motivated enough by the lack of rewards is kind of asinine to me - they aren't motivated because they don't need to be since they can clear all the content in the game while playing fairly poorly especially if they find themselves in the right group.

Ahem...
Ax gon' give it to ya! http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post4524093

Now for my actual post...

The instances to "git gud" are already in place. The logical progression at level 70 should be Expert Roulettes > 24 Man raids > 8 man raids > EX primals >*Savage > Ultimate. It's just not tight enough in it's difficulty to demand the player to step up all the way from the EX primals step. 3 out of the 4 EX primals we had this expansion are laughing stock. In no way do they prepare you for whatever Savage will bring you.

I laughed pretty hard at the start of that but you've also outlined a feeling that I've had for quite a while now absolutely perfectly.

I am on the EX primals step of this ladder and I feel like I'm stuck there because the leap to Savage is so intimidating. Logically I understand I could probably do it but I just feel like I'm going to be instantly overwhelmed and disappoint my group.

That is the biggest bridge that needs building in this game in my opinion.

[Bobs]

I was kind of waiting for an edit here (since this post ends with a parenthesis and not a period or a sentence at all really)

Casual content is by definition not particularly challenging. Which is the opposite of what the OP thinks the game needs. So really I'm agreeing with you in a way. OPs definition of FF14 is not your definition. To answer OPs "problem," it's the dev's job to provide that "carrot." What you are describing is just a bunch of smaller carrots (in my view).

Sorry for my poor punctuation and sentence structure. My Duty Finder poped.