The general player base needs to improve

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Unfortunately, player skill can never be addressed until the devs design a proper difficulty curve. I firmly believe a large contributing factor is how incredibly easy the overwhelming majority of content is, which encourages poor habits. If players can stand in AoEs or ignore mechanics throughout supposed Expert dungeons or normal mode raids, what incentive do they have not to?

Before anyone jumps to silly extreme examples, no dungeons shouldn't be Savage level nor should Savage itself return to Gordias. Doing so simply swings the scale too far in the opposite direction. A proper curve can be seen with Weeping City, which actively punished poor play without being overly difficult. On the flipside, Kugane Castle is among the worst dungeons ever designed. Why? Players aren't punished in the slightest for blatantly ignoring mechanics. Yojimbo coin phase does a maximum of 15k—not even 50% of people's HP in i290 gear. If it didn't take forever and a day to cast, people have no reason to even flinch. Once these bad habits are instilled, they become harder to break hence the frustration whenever something like say, Shinryu comes along. Suddenly, everything people have been doing doesn't work.

[Tridus]

On the flipside, Kugane Castle is among the worst dungeons ever designed. Why? Players aren't punished in the slightest for blatantly ignoring mechanics. Yojimbo coin phase does a maximum of 15k—not even 50% of people's HP in i290 gear.

Definitely a factor. Was doing Fractal Hard last night with some friends and it dawned on me that you can just stand around eating a lot of what he throws and the only thing impacted is healer DPS when they have to stop to toss a heal. I was tanking it, and while I did run out of the spin attack he does, I had no real reason to. My back was to the wall, I could have just ate it (maybe with a Sheltron) and done more DPS.

If the mechanics don't threaten you in some way, failure isn't a risk. And if failure isn't a risk, there's no necessity to improve. Thus, people who are driven to improve already will do so, but those who aren't will not.

[KaivaC]

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I'm curious...have you done endgame yourself? I dunno about how it was in the 1.0-1.23b series, I'm most familiar with current endgame in 4.x. Just wondering because of your comment about WoW and raiding, and your character level as it is currently. Unless this is an alt of yours.

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Yeah, I learned this the last time I was there as well. I tunnel visioned when I was a PLD on the final boss and got hit by one of his attacks...was barely noticable when I had a healer topping me off every time I took damage. Sometimes, I kinda wish for mobs to inflict something like healing down penalties or infirmary.

[ShanXiv]

I'm curious...have you done endgame yourself? I dunno about how it was in the 1.0-1.23b series, I'm most familiar with current endgame in 4.x. Just wondering because of your comment about WoW and raiding, and your character level as it is currently. Unless this is an alt of yours.



Yeah, I learned this the last time I was there as well. I tunnel visioned when I was a PLD on the final boss and got hit by one of his attacks...was barely noticable when I had a healer topping me off every time I took damage. Sometimes, I kinda wish for mobs to inflict something like healing down penalties or infirmary.

Ya I've mentioned in other post, I've done the first coil with my static(before nerf,not very hardcore), it was fun,
but after I tried XIV1.1x-1.2x, the "End game" thing isn't my objective when I play a MMO now,

I mean, you buy FF15 because you just want to fight the final boss & watch the ending CG movie & the staff roll?
guess not, you buy it because the stroy, because the contents in it,process is more important than the result.

I played very hardcore in WOW, because I want to know how good I can be when raiding, I've proven myself in WOW,I don't need to prove it again,
& I don't play MMO just for the gears or boss fights ,
I take the gears so I can win the next boss, if I don't raid, then highend gears mean nothing to me, I won't bother with it, ILV340 is already enough for me
if I just want to fight some boss, I will play Monster hunter, Nier, these games are a lot more fun than the heavily scripted battle in ARR.

I play MMO because the people,the community, the player-created events & contents,
but there's no such things in ARR, well.... then I play it for some rest, play it super casually,
I've played many games, XIV ARR is far from the worst , just not the real "Final Fantasy MMO" to me, a fake MMO

[Rockette]

Unpopular opinion: I enjoyed Gordias. It took us months but we cleared it just after Thordan came out. It was way too hard for a starter raid into a new expansion but it was good none the less. We busted our asses and I cried when we cleared 4. I wish we got a title for it. Midas was the right balance I thought.

Related opinion: I never pug anything. Raid group onry so I can avoid the general player base >.>

People don't want parsers so they dont need to be held accountable for their own playstyle. They don't want to know they're bad, they don't want to improve, "you don't pay my sub." So what can we do? Stick to your own groups imo. You can't fix people who firmly want to play at bare minimum capacity.

[SenorPatty]

Well we should start with something small and realistic. I'm talking about Hall of Novice and the training dummies.

Hall of novice needs an upgrade. Not just for jump potters but generally the whole populace. It should be a place where respective job trainers can teach some advanced combos or tips.

Training dummies need more than "beat this thing under 3mins". They should have the ability to be tweaked to auto-attacking you, have them set in groups (to test aoes) and other settings to allow different testing.

Those are things I feel SE could realistically do if they were serious about it and as I've mentioned, its a step.

[Tinibou]

The main problem is not really the players. It's the game itself. By making most of content relatively easy and, most of all, rushable, players don't know how to play anymore. Just put something a little more tricky and it's a catastrophe.
People don't bother to think anymore in this game so the game doesn't really require them to think.

It's even worse today when I see new players that are learning how to play the game and have already all the bad habits of the oldest veterans... and nothing will repair that.
Players also, as stated above, don't have anymore the party state of mind. Maybe only 10% of the players I met say hello when the instance starts and goodbye when it ends. It's the bare minimum...

What I mean is that the game changed the players and now it's too late.

[Sesera]

Snip

The problem is clearly player side not game side. They (bad players) don't want to improve, they don't listen when you tell them what to do and it doesn't matter how hard or easy the content is, they will act the same.
Thinking the game is at fault and not the player is like thinking a student doesn't do his homework because they are too easy but will do them if they were harder. He sure ain't gonna do them in both case.

[Tinibou]

The problem is clearly player side not game side. They (bad players) don't want to improve, they don't listen when you tell them what to do and it doesn't matter how hard or easy the content is, they will act the same.
Thinking the game is at fault and not the player is like thinking a student doesn't do his homework because they are too easy but will do them if they were harder. He sure ain't gonna do them in both case.

Let's say that there are two kind of bad players. The ones who don't want to improve, sure, it's not the game's fault. But still, I think the game kinda educated the players to be more lazy, to not need as much concentration as they'd have need before and so on.

All of that make the players more bad than before and in that sense, it's the game fault, the game design, how the game changed to make it a run for tomestomes, roulettes and everything that 90% of the players rush while watching Netflix and without thinking.

[Sesera]

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Honestly there is only one type of bad player it's the ones who don't want to improve.
There is a big difference between not perfoming well because you're are new and lack experience and not performing well because "I don't care if i'm a burden I have fun slacking in aoe while spamming blizzard 2 all day, don't tell me how to play"

And no most player are playing the game otherwise you would fail every duty. This reminds me the anti lfr crowd in WoW where they were claiming you could afk and still win. If a minority act like that, yes you will be able to succeed but if it's the majority you won't.