The general player base needs to improve

[Keridwyn]

There is a definite problem when I start noticing poor play. I am about as bog average a player as you can find, I do my job competently but long ago ceeded the fact that my ping did not predict greatness. On a good day it's still over 100ms. On a bad day...well...I am sure Hashmal appreciates the sacrifice. If I start spiking I will drop group, you will clear faster waiting for another healer than putting up with me if you've a need for speed.

That said, before we start ramping up difficulties I think we need to focus a bit more on in game learning. A Hall of the Intermediate where they show off things like all the various markers and telegraphs might go a long way to easing some of the derp for those who don't watch vidoes or read walkthroughs. Maybe even cover some mid-tier class combos and abilities? Level 15 was a long time ago...

[Vhailor]

That’s what I want to say, but that doesn’t help improve the overall NA playerbase. So now I turn to the OF. Combat skills for most classes have been neutered enough that players should have a general idea of how to do their rotations. Other than SMN and possibly some other DPS which I have little to no experience with, what else can the devs do to get the playerbase on a much higher level?

Honestly, I don't know that SE can do much. The root problem is how FFXIV (and most modern MMOs) is designed, in my estimation.

Take Garuda EX, which you used as an example. There are three factors that lead to it being a struggle for the vast majority of level-synced groups making the attempt: (a) it's old content, so memory has faded; (b) it has a number of mechanics that will punish a group quite severely (typically wiping it) if they are forgotten; and (c) it's fast-paced enough that groups can't easily communicate in the middle of it. There's nothing SE, nor really anyone, can feasibly do to mitigate the significant struggles that arise as a result of these three combined factors, and they don't just impact Garuda EX - they eventually impact every piece of content in FFXIV that isn't nerfed into the ground, difficulty-wise.

Older MMOs evaded this problem somewhat because content didn't age so quickly, and because it was slower-paced, allowing for communication. Take Dynamis from FFXI as an example; that event required vastly more coordination than virtually any content in FFXIV, and was quite brutal if anyone messed up. Yet, it was relevant content for years, and it was slow enough that the leaders of any particular group could ensure everyone was on the same page for the most part. That translated to a higher perceived level of competency, because individuals didn't have to deal with memory and speed and difficulty all at the same time.

All this to say, I don't think the general skill of gamers has gone down that much. I do, however, think that FFXIV's design demands far more from players than we sometimes realize. There's a price to pay for fast-paced content that is rapidly deprecated, and this is a significant part of it. And, to connect this as well with the attitude problems of players, people who are overwhelmed often lash out in anger or frustration. It's human nature. And it's a guaranteed outcome from the design decisions that SE has made for FFXIV.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

Some of the things said here recently got me like. . .

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

I've seen my fair share of failures all over this game. Simply by the game's design, no one player can do it all, at least outside of PotD (and even that can be a massive challenge solo).

There's nothing more frustrating than doing it all right, and someone's action (or inaction) makes it all null and void. And while that might seem like an extreme, I've seen that happen in many ways, many times.

[VanilleFang]

I'm going to preface this post with mentioning that I understand that FFXIV is just a video game. It should be fun first and foremost. People shouldn't see the game as a chore or a job but as entertainment. But that aside I agree that players can sometimes be pretty painful to play with.

FFXIV is a video game, yes, but it is also an MMO. Being an MMO means that you will often play with other people so their time should be considered. If you are okay with just spamming Heavy Thrust, or with eating every AoE in the game, or with playing spin the bottle while tanking thats fine... When you are playing alone or with people who also don't mind. Playing this way with strangers is not only a waste of time, but it's rather rude.

You might be thinking: "But Vanille you telling people to play the way you want them to play is rude too!" No, I'm not asking people to play a specific way, I'm asking that people take other players into consideration and at least try when they are playing. I've carried teams through some content because people can't be assed to look under their feet at the big glowing red circle/line/whatever. I've encountered players who don't understand important tools in their kits. I've encountered many, many players who just don't seem to care how they perform, even when it negatively impacts the experience for other players.

Sure I could go play with a static or an FC, but I haven't really had anyone I could play with like this until recently. And even still I'm mostly playing alone. Why should I have to have to look for a group of decent players? Shouldn't being decent be the bare minimum players strive for? I can't even imagine how boring it must be to play this game when I see how other's play. (I don't want to get into this whole debate but as an example...) Like a healer who just stands there and casts Cure every 3 seconds. How is that entertaining? How is that interesting at all? Like I've said FFXIV should be entertainment first and foremost. So why are people playing in such mundane, boring, and repetitive ways? My mind can't grasp how that is fun for anyone.

This sort of leads into another issue I have... When I see someone making mistakes consistently, or misusing an ability, I might offer help. I don't try to come across as condescending or elitist, I just offer some points if they would like them. Sometimes I give pointers without even asking now because me asking generally gets me no where. The general responses to me just trying to make the person passable at their job is generally silence. I don't even see rude replies that often, just silence. They then continue doing what I was wanting to help correct. But WHY? Why do some players want to play subpar? It boggles my mind.

This post has probably been a jumbled mess, and I am surely to be labelled an elitist, but I just want people to play in a way that at least shows they understand that other players' time matters as well. Is it so much to ask that you at least try to play your job as it was intended to be played?

[Metalwrath]

To be fair i dont think its unreasonable to expect a level 70 player to know basic rotations by that stage.POTD is a lot to blame i think.

[Kacho_Nacho]

To be fair i dont think its unreasonable to expect a level 70 player to know basic rotations by that stage.POTD is a lot to blame i think.

Yes. The biggest issue with PoTD isn't that it helps players level jobs quickly. It's that the mobs die so fast there is no time to do a rotation. So, players reach 50 or so and have no experience with the full toolkit of their jobs. But, if you get rid of PoTD, raising alt jobs will frustrate players due to the amount of effort involved. It would better if the mobs of PoTD had more health, allowing players to do their basic rotations.

[Dzian]

I\\'m going to preface this post with mentioning that I understand that FFXIV is just a video game. It should be fun first and foremost. People shouldn\\'t see the game as a chore or a job but as entertainment. But that aside I agree that players can sometimes be pretty painful to play with.

Honestly I kinda hate that sentiment. Just a video game. Not a chore not a career just entertainment.

The reason I hate that is because like many gamers video games are not a chore they are not a career they are not just entertainment.

What they are is a hobby. And like with any other hobbies people want to be challenged.

No one picks up karate with the aim of staying the bottom belt forever they want to be challenged and climb the belts

No one joins a football team that doesn\\'t want to win games, the cup or league or whatever.

Painting drawing baking all exactly the same.

Being challenged in videogames is no bad thing and certainly does not make it a full time career or chore.

Sure some people play just to kill time but others see it more of a hobby..

I fly model helicopters and planes. It's a hobby I always want to improve and get better at it. Does not make it a career or a chore

[VanilleFang]

hobby

My statement wasn't intended to be dismissive. I can say soccer is just a sport, or The Hobbit is just a book, or Aliens is just a movie.

I never said getting better or trying to be the best you can is a chore in FFXIV. I've had people say that to me, but I never made that claim myself. What I was saying that if it does feel that way you should stop and instead make the game fun again.

If I need to be blunt I will. My post was me trying to find a nice way to say "get better because I don't want to carry your ass or waste my time". But I also wanted to make it clear that no one should play if they find it unfun.

[Mesarthim]

Now I just came out of an expert on my alt on aether and I really have to question people's situational awareness. I don't suppose this game teaches you what a vulnerability up stack is? This tank I had stood in his sephirot-mode puddle on the second fractal hard boss until he had 8 stacks (two puddles merged!). Then proceeded to basically be one shot by the next tankbuster.

It's probably things like this that spurred this thread into existence. Clearly something is going wrong somewhere in the ffxiv cogwheels.