Yotsuyu inconsistencies

[OrenjiStar]

I am so confused about Yotsuyu's backstory. It is different literally every time it is brought up.

First off, spoilers if you haven't done 4.2

The first major backstory cutscene we get is the conscripted impirial officer that the WoL catches. This calls upon the echo and we see a flashback where he is speaking with a woman and her son (presumably Asahi?). A young Yotsuyu approaches and the woman claims that Yotsuyu's family has dies and that she is her niece.

The next one is when we are confronting Yotsuyu and she herself tells us her parents mistreated her and then married her off to a rich old man the first chance they got. When he died, she was sold to a pleasure house to settle debts he had since incurred.

THEN we talk to the captain in the Doman Liberation Front and HE says that her FATHER sold her to the brothel.

[OrenjiStar]

So at this point I figured that her mother was the woman in the first cutscene. She lied to the imperial, having no love for her "extra" and female child, trying to avoid even more expenses. They married her to the old man, then got her back when he died, THEN sold her to the brothel.

But then Asahi comes along and Yugiri immediately says he is Yotsuyu's STEPbrother. Not even HALFbrother (which people often mistakenly use interchaneably).

So now I'm just wondering, WHAT is going on here!? Is there a translation problem!? Are the localisers finding this delicate subject matter to work around and are creating inconsistencies!? How could two unrelated people make the same demented face so well!? Are these in fact not writing errors, but something that is put in intentionally and will be made clear later!?

I guess what I'm really asking is if there is anyone who has any insight from other translations or their own thoughts to add, 'cause I'm hella confused.

[OrenjiStar]

Like, why even make it this complicated?

[TinyRedLeaf]

It's quite clear that Yotsuyu was adopted and was treated as chattel by her adoptive parents.

She said at the fall of Doma Castle:

[My parents] worked me from dawn to dusk, like an ox or an ass, or some other beast of burden. Until, that is, my brother spied a chance to transform the family fortunes. And so I was married to a vicious old drunk who beat me as he please, and when I pleaded for help, I was told to grin and bear it. For the family. For him*. For everyone's sake. They pretended not to notice, but they knew. They knew.

What did it matter? I was nothing to them — less than nothing! I wasn't of their flesh, I wasn't a fellow Doman**, I wasn't even a person. I might just as well have been dead!

And then my husband passed away one day. And so I was sold off yet again***, to pay his debts. But this time, this time, I found a way to live for myself. To survive. As a spy for the Empire.

Oh, those were the days, when the scales first fell from my eyes. No longer would I be a slave to my parents or my husband or the pleasure house. I would be free...and receive due compensation.

* It's not clear who is the "him" Yotsuyu is referring to in this sentence. But based on the context, it seems that it's her brother, as she said it was her brother who "spied a chance to transform the family fortunes". It seems it was Asahi who suggested a marriage of convenience, to enhance his political fortunes.

** "I wasn't of their flesh, I wasn't a fellow Doman." I think this is as clear as it gets, regarding Yotsuyu's actual origins. She wasn't Doman to begin with, and she was adopted by Asahi's parents, for reasons we don't yet know.

*** "I was sold off yet again." It's not clear, from Yotsuyu's confession, who sold her off the second time. If her husband had been someone politically important, was it her husband's estate that sold her off? Or was it Yotsuyu's adoptive father who sold her again? We don't really know.

===============

Now, let's compare what Yotsuyu said against the captured Imperial officer's version of events:

Haunted elder/Keen-eyed soldier
...Rest assured, the Naeuri will receive due compensation. Young Asahi has great potential — that much is plain. If he applies himself, he may one day be granted the opportunity to go to Garlemald and learn from some of the leading authorities in the field of magitek. Few citizens are afforded such treatment, however — much less people of the provinces. You will need to do more^ —

Doting Mother
Oh, oh, of course! Have no doubt that we shall! My husband and I want only the best imperial education for our boy!

Yotsuyu arrives to report she had planted the rice, only to be scolded for interrupting her mother while the officer was speaking to her.

Haunted elder/Keen-eyed soldier
You did not mention that you had a daughter.

Doting Mother
My sister's, not mine^^ — kami rest her soul. <sigh> She is utterly hopeless, but one cannot choose one's family.

^ The officer did not say at the time what "doing more" may entail. But that was the germ of the idea Asahi would eventually hatch one day, to sell off his adoptive sister for political advantage.

^^ And there you have it. Yotsuyu is actually Asahi's cousin, but was adopted into the Naeuri clan after the death of his mother's sister. And given what Yotsuyu said about her not being Doman, it's likely that her biological father was a foreigner. Yotsuyu's biological mother was likely a social outcast, for marrying out of "polite" Doman society. Hence the contempt that Yotsuyu inherited.

[OrenjiStar]

No no no. Every other Doman has said she was Doman, and she looks Doman. When she said that she wasn't of their flesh, not a Doman, not even a person, that last example makes it plain that she means that is how her family saw her, not her speaking literally. Even if Yotsuyu and Asahi are cousins instead, what I am asking is why not just say that? Half of what you said is "it's unclear" or "it's uncertain" and "maybe." But that is exactly what I'm saying. WHY is it so unclear? I find these details jarring and distracting and that it takes away from telling a smooth narrative that is supposed to make us feel something for her. So again, does anyone know if it is any clearer in any other translation?

[Anonymoose]

Yotsuyu's adoptive mother stammers and giggles through most of what she says even in Japanese, so her story isn't necessarily any more credible than her claim that she's too sickly to attend school. However, the inter-language references we do to family repeatedly specify that she calls her adoptive family by their adoptive roles. After the adoption, this woman was "mother". I'd originally suspected that "mom" was even lying about that, but it doesn't seem to be the case right now, since 4.2 doubled down on, "By Blood: Asasi = Cousin".

Still, I feel that this can probably be cleared up by focusing on two specific lines.

When Gosetsu tries to anger Yotsuyu, he does it by calling her:

Orphan of the Naeuri. Widow of Sashihai.

Dead parents from the Naeuri clan.
Dead husband from the Sashihai clan.

When Yotsuyu is explaining herself, she says

I wasn't of their flesh, I wasn't a fellow Doman, I wasn't even a person. I might just as well have been dead!

As far as I can tell, she's not talking about reality, she's talking about how she feels that she was seen.

Notice that it's increasingly severe stages of dehumanization.

They didn't see me as part of their family.
Never mind family, they didn't see me as part of their culture.
Never mind culture, they didn't even see me as a human being.
Never mind human being, they might as well have not even seen me as a living thing.

Not kin. Not country. Not human. Not living.

In Japanese the line is merely a reference to filial piety robbing her of her personhood.

"Honor thy parents. Submit to thy husband. I was no longer my own. No one in Doma considered my heart to even exist."

This part is pure speculation but I can't help but wonder if the Haunted Elder was a Sashihei himself, that he took advantage of the family's eagerness to prove themselves to the empire to secure their cute kid for some creepy uncle or something, furthering his own status in the clan without thinking of or realizing just what he was setting her up for and how she would revenge herself on their entire culture for it.

Still, between Gosetsu, 4.2's labels, and the ability to not take one of the confounding lines literally, the number of possible interpretations (at least for what the game wants us to believe) dwindles.

[Vidu]

Well, I'd reckon its supposed to give a bit of a flavour to the story(telling) - aswell as it makes sense that Yotsuyu herself might not be to kean to talk much/clear about her family, that she seems to despise (for good reasons).
Fellow Domans probably dont even know about her story.
Doma is also just this small kingdom - her family (or at least her father) could have come from anywhere in Hingashi.

But you were asking if its any clearer in other translations - I'll copy and try to translate the german one for you then. Its the same passage that Redleaf already quoted. I'd consider it quite clear both in english and in german and had little trouble piecing together that Yotsuyu was taking in by her aunt and uncle who later sold her off to her husband. After he died the german version kind implies that someone who was taking care of her husbands debts sold her aswell as he sold the estate of her husband etc.
But here you go:

Yotsuyus mom:
Das Kind meiner Schwester, mögen die Kami sie selig haben, nicht meins. <seufz> Das Kind ist ein Nichtsnutz, aber was sollen wir machen? Familie ist Familie.

Yotsuyus mother:
The child of my sister, kami rest her soul, not mine. <sigh> The child is a good-for-nothing, but what are we supposed to do? Family is family.

To me its quite clear here that
1) this woman isnt Yotsuyus bioligical mother but her aunt
2) at least her mother is dead
3) Yotsuyu isnt excatly loved by her foster-mom-aunt

The passage before makes it quite clear that Ashi is indeed the son of the person called "Yotsuyus mom", making Yotsuyu and Ashai cousins.
The german version isnt to different from the english one - and I'd consider both quite clear? Aswell as the whole situation not being uncommon: A young child without parents going to live with their next of kin, in this case an aunt and uncle. Even though they clearly misstreated her they clearly made her call them "Mother" (and most likely "Father") and expected her to treat them as if they were her biological parents. And Ashai as if he was her brother, not her cousin.

[TinyRedLeaf]

No no no. Every other Doman has said she was Doman, and she looks Doman. When she said that she wasn't of their flesh, not a Doman, not even a person, that last example makes it plain that she means that is how her family saw her, not her speaking literally.

I don't quite recall if there were other Domans who said Yotsuyu was Doman, but I take your point that she was perhaps speaking figuratively about the progressive stages of her dehumanisation by Doman society.

To be sure, Yotsuyu's nationality isn't really an important point to me. I simply thought that a foreign origin was perhaps the easiest explanation for the cruel treatment she received. That said, in a time of hardship and deprivation, it's understandable that even close relatives would turn against their kin. Yotsuyu was, after all, an extra mouth that the Naeuri clan could ill afford to feed.

Even if Yotsuyu and Asahi are cousins instead, what I am asking is why not just say that? Half of what you said is "it's unclear" or "it's uncertain" and "maybe." But that is exactly what I'm saying. WHY is it so unclear?

I honestly don't know why you find it unclear. Biologically, they're cousins. That much is certain. But in legal terms, Yotsuyu has also been Asahi's sibling since her adoption by the Naeuri clan. I don't know how it is in your real-life culture but, certainly, in Asia, once you've been adopted, you are part of that family, and you'd address your siblings as brothers and sisters.

Incidentally, adoption was a very common practice in ancient China and Japan, especially given the nature of extended families. If any one branch of a clan were to run out of heirs because of war or disease, it's not uncommon to adopt a child from a cadet branch, to ensure a smooth line of succession. Once you're adopted, you're officially a member of that family, and your past relations no longer matter.

In any case, the point is that Yotsuyu was treated as a commodity, even by her relatives, to be used and disposed of at whim. She wasn't regarded as human and so, in time, she too ceased to regard the people around her as human. The tragedy is that this does happen in real life, more often than we'd care to admit.

These tragedies, at the personal level, are the reason that Stormblood has resonated far more strongly with me than Heavensward, because it's so much easier for me to see the real-life parallels between what the fictional characters go through, and what I know real people do actually suffer.

[OrenjiStar]

Sorry it took so long to get back this. I got really sick and had to return to work immediately after. Thanks for all of the replies. I think this makes things much easier to understand, particularly the part about Asian culture that once you have been adopted that your new familial titles take presidence to your old ones.

[Phelios]

Hmmm my mind went to a darker place. I thought that young soldier was looking at Yotsuyu and was enamored by her. Like a game of thrones type of thing. Thus she was sold off like that to advance Ashai cause that way.