Samurai and Red Mage

[KDSilver]

Red Mage doesn't need a buff, please, stop with this. Its current state is right with what it does.

Only SAM need to be looked at because MNK do almost the same amount of damage.

[JohnnyDevo]

Red Mage doesn't need a buff, please, stop with this. Its current state is right with what it does.

Only SAM need to be looked at because MNK do almost the same amount of damage.

- Lowest dps in the game
- near-lowest utility in the game
- doesn't need a buff

Pick two.

[Dualgunner]

Red Mage doesn't need a buff, please, stop with this. Its current state is right with what it does.

Only SAM need to be looked at because MNK do almost the same amount of damage.

I assume you're talking about RDM's verraise utility and vercure utility. I'm going to quote Claire at you regarding verraise since I find it to be the most clear way of putting it I've seen.

Personally as a RDM, I hear a lot of ppl say how much they like RDM for prog... but no one I know, who isnt a healer doing the prog, agrees.
Once you die, and rez up, you're not really learning how to optimize your rotation based on where you are in the fight anymore, as everything is now thrown off, and are essentially learning nothing.
Only if you're a healer, will you see little to no change in this.

I'll add: this tier I've had the unique opportunity to prog in two groups, one that has a SMN for prog, and one that has a RDM for prog (me). In this tier, I've noticed no area where verraise was a uniquely powerful utility that saved the group beyond SMN's own swiftraise, because beyond that, it wasn't worth continuing prog because we'd hit enrage.
In fact, the group with the SMN has gotten farther faster because we go back to the beginning and work on re-optimizing from there, rather than wasting time in my RDM group trying to salvage a run only to hit enrage.
I'll cede, this is anecdote. But it is a unique experience I thought I'd share.

As far as vercure, it's not a heal to be relied on. It can keep one target alive through sustained damage maybe, at the cost of 270-300 potency. As with last tier, it's mainly used to proc a dualcast during downtime.

This leaves RDM near the bottom of the totem pole, with only embolden to their name, for as much as that's worth, it doesn't make up for where they sit in the grand scheme of things.

[Zyneste]

Give Fleche Piercing Resistance Down. Duration 30 seconds, Cool down 25 seconds. Opens up a slot for MNK/Sam. Bard/MCH are 100% necessary for prog. Refresh is no joke. They need piercing down or they are screwed out of 5%+ dps. It would also raise RDM DPS by 1% when not present with a DRG.

Although it wouldn't boost a RDMs personal damage, it would allow more class diversity without RDM losing DPS.

Thats an easy step I feel to make DRG less necessary and RDM more in demand.

That along with changing embolden to being damage done increase all around (instead of just physical, thereby buffing RDM DPS and helping to create a more equal magical and physical meta.)

and Oh if DRK could get a magic resistance Down debuff, that would be great.

[Shurrikhan]

Give Fleche Piercing Resistance Down. Duration 30 seconds, Cool down 25 seconds. Opens up a slot for MNK/Sam. Bard/MCH are 100% necessary for prog. Refresh is no joke. They need piercing down or they are screwed out of 5%+ dps. It would also raise RDM DPS by 1% when not present with a DRG.

Although it wouldn't boost a RDMs personal damage, it would allow more class diversity without RDM losing DPS.

Thats an easy step I feel to make DRG less necessary and RDM more in demand.

That along with changing embolden to being damage done increase all around (instead of just physical, thereby buffing RDM DPS and helping to create a more equal magical and physical meta.)

*and Oh if DRK could get a magic resistance Down debuff, that would be great.

While DRG does have a higher participation rate than even NIN of late, judging by fflog's (wholly voluntary, it's worth noting) top 100 speedkill reports, I usually feel very hesitant about taking away or spreading out something so core, and worry that an added 290-330 DPS per ranged DPS may actually be overkill, all without making the job itself feel more functional -- especially if atop, say, Embolden now affecting all damage types instead of just physical.

You're absolutely right, though, that we could probably use an alternative to DRG in terms of supporting our ranged. I don't personally like the idea of piercing being an absolute in the same sense that Slashing is now, and would have preferred that Ninja's being the lowest DPS (outside of God Kefka, apparently?) when piercing is present were due to its Shadewalker and Smokescreen utilities still being of DPS-equatable value, rather than almost solely due to Trick Attack itself, but given the damage our Ranged are putting out, RDM could definitely make an interesting competitor in terms of a lowest personal DPS class that still stands to contribute significant indirect DPS. I just wonder how copying Piercing, providing Embolden in place of Battle Litany, and still lacking Dragon Sight atop such a large pDPS difference would be sufficient for such a competition, and whether the total number of composition choices would not suffer for a forced RDM/DRG slot, as having twice the options to provide Piercing would only further solidify and holds of double Ranged setups, and therefore also their keystone party member, whichever of the two it may be.

(*I'd personally rather DRK was simply buffed in its own right, and Monk and RDM's buffs both be generalized, rather than see further caster/physical schisms. Parties have cleared Kefka just fine with duplicates as is. Assuming DRK were given meaningful magic damage components, the new meta for constant-uptime magic-heavy fights could easily just swap to BLM/BLM/BLM/NIN/DRK/PLD/AST/SCH or BLMx4/WAR/DRK/AST/SCH with little looking back. At over half a Refresh's total MP generation per Mana Shift and only two-thirds of its cooldown, with effectively no cost to the giver itself if given early in UI phase, Apoc/Virus rotations, and zero need for Tactician (Goad being sufficient for any dead tank), the rangeds' job is more than covered.)

The dot no need to be a new skill, it could be just an additional effect from an ability say... impact?

It doesnt need to be strong, i feel a bit “empty” whenever i cast my skill as rdm because in the mid of casting and waiting the GCD thanks to dual cast effect, i feel like iam not contributing anything.

Even BLM has thunder to fill in, healer has instant dot skill to contribute, rdm just... nothing

Honestly, I don't see any need one way or another for DoT damage. Imo, at best they're something that allows for increased multi-target potential until AoEs become optimal over them. In single-target, though, they augment gameplay only insofar as many other intersecting windows can present decisions around them; that is not something the DoT contributes uniquely nor on its own.

That said, there could potentially be a use for a mana-generating DoT if there were ever reason to effectively bank (via said DoT) more than one's maximum Black/White mana. At that point, there may finally be a reason to keep Impact as a separate skill from Jolt II. That said, it would carry less synergy with Manafication than instant mana generation would.

[Maero]

I cannot agree with the user that stated Red Mage does not need a buff. Just because it is a simple job does not equate it should not do more damage.
For ARR and a good portion of HW Bard was very simple..
Which brings up to the other point, utility wise other then raise what does Red Mage bring? Some are so big to point out utility but embolden is not big enough of a contribution.
Jobs like Bard bring far more utility and does do more damage (this could be debated mind you). So perhaps slight buffs and changes need to be made. Higher cost for verraise, and certainly changes to embolden.

As for movement, it is not of issue like that of blm, then again smn is not really hindered by movement so much either..

The only bad part is if you mana shift and say use Lucid Dream (the amount of times i need to raise healers) and then for whatever reason get killed, Red Mage is then completely out o f mana once raised, so another form of regaining mana perhaps could be nice. This is about one of the only situations were your dps could drop down.

[gumas]

RDM impact ability should replace jolt when proc, why they put it as another ability in a different skill slot is beyond me.

Other than that i think RDM is fine, they could use a dot skill though

[Zyneste]

RDM impact ability should replace jolt when proc, why they put it as another ability in a different skill slot is beyond me.

Other than that i think RDM is fine, they could use a dot skill though

Noooo. Impact is the bane of my existence. If you dont use it early and it has 2 seconds left at the start of your cast, it will drop before it finishes. Its better to just Jolt II again.

[Claire_Pendragon]

RDM impact ability should replace jolt when proc, why they put it as another ability in a different skill slot is beyond me.

Other than that i think RDM is fine, they could use a dot skill though

I used to think RDM needed a DoT, but the more I played it, the more I started to think otherwise, but its hard to explain why, but mostly to do with how everything lines up in fights, and how much the RNG of RDM can make a DoT further hinder a RDMs unlucky RNG. (All jobs get bad RNG, but some jobs get it worse than others, and currently RDM isnt that bad, but a DoT falling off at the wrong time, prevents setting up a good flow to your rotation, due to being a job that needs to adjust.) Also being a job that has to go into range, even if it lowers their DPS, due to getting enough mana to melee, is another one of its problems, which is yet another reason it needs a buff.
But i agree, dont giev magic vuln to embolden, we dont need to be the new NIN.

[gumas]

The dot no need to be a new skill, it could be just an additional effect from an ability say... impact?

It doesnt need to be strong, i feel a bit “empty” whenever i cast my skill as rdm because in the mid of casting and waiting the GCD thanks to dual cast effect, i feel like iam not contributing anything.

Even BLM has thunder to fill in, healer has instant dot skill to contribute, rdm just... nothing