Square should get its own house in order

[Mahrze]

I didn't say FC ownership. I said FC house ownership. Making the ownership requirements the same as the buying requirements would make every player meet the same criteria and likely put a crimp in the flippers as they would need a paid account for every house they wanted to flip concurrently. As it is now they only need one paid and can use lots of free accounts to transfer ownership.

And it falls on the same thing: To gain rank for a house can be done within a day if you have the resources. Hence why the people who currently abuse the system have no problem doing so. Whereas those who are looking to buy a house will have additional issues to deal besides the current one.

Scorch-earth tactics are not gonna hurt the people some think they will. These level 1 "owners" were promoted to the rank. Adding requirements to FC house ownerships opens a can of worms on who can retain ownership.

[TaleraRistain]

Yeah, it's a cool update on the housing rules and I applaud them. I just pointed that they should be retroactive to make it fair.

How is punishing players now for gaps in their code and logic remotely fair? You have to stop seeing those players as having done something wrong. They didn't. SE had a gap. When you are a programmer and you find a gap, you don't punish those that may have been able to do things you didn't expect because you didn't account for their creative bypassing of you rules. You suck it up and you close the gap. People have gotten around my code before. I make it so they can't do that anymore, but I don't drag them into HR because my code had a flaw.

[Elamys]

As the person above pointed out they can use airship parts they've bought. But you didn't address the other reasons I gave as to why the might have that plot...

First of all, sorry I couldn't immediately respond to this, I hit my post limit, but uh, thanks for deleting yours, I guess? Embarrassed about something?

A level one character is not going to be able to take much advantage of an additional workshop or airships. They can't transfer any materials without using a friend to do so. They won't be able to use it for more retainers to sell on because they can't have retainers. Any money they spend will have to be spent on another character, either via an alt or friend, with the gil itself needing to have been transferred via a friend, because they won't exactly have any income, because they are level one with no retainer access. We know they're not transferring gil or items via an FC chest because the FCs in question have only one member. The only other reason, RP, is the only reason I could feasibly think of, but how large is Ragnarok's RP community? As far as I'm aware, only Balmung, Gilgamesh, and Mateus have any really notable RPer presence. What is the actual chance of all of these houses being owned by level one roleplayers? As a roleplayer myself, I'm more inclined to level more so I can access more areas and settings to play in.

You're just believing what you want to believe without any actual evidence. I gave you other reasons they might have a plot and I just thought of another one, maybe they just really like decorating/want multiple houses.

Owning multiple houses on a server is now directly against the rules anyways, so finding some way around that after the changes is indeed circumventing the rules. Who here is being more willful about what they want to believe? It is a known fact that there is an enormous amount of flipping going on, and that people are making shell FCs to buy a personal house when it was restricted. Is it truly so hard for you to believe that the owners of these plots don't have suspicious intentions? By the way:

I'm assuming from the fact you're on Balmung you probably didn't get a house so you're going after anyone and everyone else who has one because they may or may not have done things you disagree with?

For the thousandth time, I have a house, on Balmung. A very nice plot, too, being a beachfront medium in Mist. I've had it since Stormblood launched. I'm just sick of seeing people get screwed while others, for some reason, defend this awful system - probably because they feel special for owning a house.

[Madbunny]

Transfering is not a solution.

If you are in minority then it is. You cant expect SE to change everything based on few servers while wast majority were half empty until they lifted the restrictions.

I'm sorry, should I transfer and abandon my server just because some people can't play nice?

Ofc no, but you should transfer if the house is your priority or end game. You want to enjoy all the perks of overpopulated server... well then its your choice.

Last housing patch at least show us who are the people willing to change something to get the house and who are those who will endlessly complain and ask SE to modify the game on their likeness. But you know what, free to complain while the smart ones at this moment enjoy their new home.

[Penthea]

I am in two minds about going after fcs with very few or even one member.

Some people are not overly social. They might actually be happy in their tiny fc whether it's with just a handful of friends or on their own. I know it's common for many players to get a second house with a shell fc, but there are some out there who would have been in their tiny fc anyway even if housing wasn't a thing.

And well maybe in some cases the fc fell apart and the fc master does plan on recruiting and get it going again.

The point I'm making is, just because a fc is tiny or has only one member doesn't mean it's a player who made a shell fc to abuse the housing system. There isn't a system in place to check this, and I think it would be a bad move by SE to blindly clamp down on it. Instead SE should take away the incentive to make shell fcs.

A good start would be allowing all characters on the same server have access to the private house. I would even go as far as to say allow each character to have a private room, much like a fc room, so players can have little custom rooms for each of their characters. In essence a private home would be like a personal fc house for the player, just without the workshop.

[Aldotsk]

A level one character is not going to be able to take much advantage of an additional workshop or airships. They can't transfer any materials without using a friend to do so. They won't be able to use it for more retainers to sell on because they can't have retainers. Any money they spend will have to be spent on another character, either via an alt or friend, with the gil itself needing to have been transferred via a friend, because they won't exactly have any income, because they are level one with no retainer access. We know they're not transferring gil or items via an FC chest because the FCs in question have only one member. The only other reason, RP, is the only reason I could feasibly think of, but how large is Ragnarok's RP community? As far as I'm aware, only Balmung, Gilgamesh, and Mateus have any really notable RPer presence. What is the actual chance of all of these houses being owned by level one roleplayers? As a roleplayer myself, I'm more inclined to level more so I can access more areas and settings to play in.

I am sorry but I have to say this. While it is an unjustifiable cause that Ragnarok had to suffer for one FC to purchase entire ward, they had done NOTHING to violate the rules. Ethic and Rules don't apply in this game. Get that in your head.

Owning multiple houses on a server is now directly against the rules anyways, so finding some way around that after the changes is indeed circumventing the rules.

I think you are misunderstanding the difference between new policy set on new purchasers vs grandfathered owners. And also owning multiple houses isn't against the rules. It's programmed to PREVENT new purchasers. Not in ToS. House Flipping -IS- however against ToS. I think we need to have that cleared up for you.

Grandfathering was never against a rule policy. Not in new 4.2 housing rules. It CLEARLY says "you can relocate without timer cooldown". Which means people who owned the plots BEFORE can relocate as grandfathering and give the FC that they owned to a lvl 1 alt without penalty. The policy ALSO says that ANY houses that were owned before are not taken away and for theirs to keep. You know what that means? The Mateus's infamous Ward 12 Goblet by two players are for theirs to keep with level 1 alts owning FC houses. It's not against the rules.

No one did RMT and no one definitely did house flipping. You want to report the player? Go to Ragnarok and file a report. Like every GMs tell you. Don't rant in here in this thread about how unjustified it is. The ONLY thing that will be settled in this board is if you request maybe more wards, or even more housing function. NOT rant about how it is unfair about level 1 owning the house and selling it. But I can tell you that GMs won't be able to ban someone from the source outside of the game logs. You could literally bait that player to buy it and try to talk the person in-game chat and report him.

The only way for grandfathers to give up their plot is either they in-game talk about house flipping and is caught in public or other players, OR they accidentally didnt visit their house within 40 days to refresh it and auto-demolish the plot.

That's the only TWO options there. GMs can't do anything else.

[Rinuko]

First of all, sorry I couldn't immediately respond to this, I hit my post limit, but uh, thanks for deleting yours, I guess? Embarrassed about something?

A level one character is not going to be able to take much advantage of an additional workshop or airships. They can't transfer any materials without using a friend to do so. They won't be able to use it for more retainers to sell on because they can't have retainers.

What if they used story skip potion though?

[Mahrze]

A level one character is not going to be able to take much advantage of an additional workshop or airships. They can't transfer any materials without using a friend to do so. They won't be able to use it for more retainers to sell on because they can't have retainers. Any money they spend will have to be spent on another character, either via an alt or friend, with the gil itself needing to have been transferred via a friend, because they won't exactly have any income, because they are level one with no retainer access. We know they're not transferring gil or items via an FC chest because the FCs in question have only one member. The only other reason, RP, is the only reason I could feasibly think of, but how large is Ragnarok's RP community? As far as I'm aware, only Balmung, Gilgamesh, and Mateus have any really notable RPer presence. What is the actual chance of all of these houses being owned by level one roleplayers? As a roleplayer myself, I'm more inclined to level more so I can access more areas and settings to play in.

However, that level one alt is the anchor to the multiple FCs which any character can join the FC, said character has all the tools and things needed to make use of the workshop and as such, does so. There is little need to try to "justify" the ownership with some rose-tinted glass. We know the intent behind owning multiple FC plots for certain players or group of players and its happened for a while. All of this "logical" fallacy is unnecessary.

Owning multiple houses on a server is now directly against the rules anyways, so finding some way around that after the changes is indeed circumventing the rules. Who here is being more willful about what they want to believe? It is a known fact that there is an enormous amount of flipping going on, and that people are making shell FCs to buy a personal house when it was restricted. Is it truly so hard for you to believe that the owners of these plots don't have suspicious intentions? By the way: https://i.imgur.com/YGvhI7e.png

One player makes an alt. Other player invites alt to the FC, transfers leadership and boom. This has been done, used and abused on many levels and SE can't do anything about it. Restricting such a process can hamper other instances when part of these steps would be needed on a "better" circumstance.

For the thousandth time, I have a house, on Balmung. A very nice plot, too, being a beachfront medium in Mist. I've had it since Stormblood launched. I'm just sick of seeing people get screwed while others, for some reason, defend this awful system - probably because they feel special for owning a house. https://i.imgur.com/A1Qg4wC.png

I don't own a house, used to and found it a weak system. know plenty of people who own one, or two or n number of houses. I see housing as the most weak deployment of something in its class in my gaming experience. I would love to see it "deleted" if they wont (because they can) really give it structure.

I'm just sick of seeing people demand "justice" with scorch-earth policies and threats because they have a haywire "moral" compass which makes them feel they can defend some while "punishing" others. You have a house, if you want someone to have one because they should, demolish yours. "But they have more than one" makes no difference. An open house plot is still that, regardless of size.

[Mithia]

I don't see the problem in these shell FC's, its simply bad design from the developers, which they have admitted to.

While the workshop is a nice idea, its ultimately the gil advantage that is causing this issue. If the workshop, and gardening, could be taken out of housing and put into something else the problem would solve itself as housing in its essence has just become vanity.

[Wintersandman]

I don't even see why the work shop is even being brought up. Can have a shell FC for a lot of reasons. FC chest, etc. That person may like decorating houses and therefore have a level 1 and due to them having the resources they are probably a crafter and using the FC and level 1 class as a mule. I have a small and would love to upgrade my house to a large at somepoint. Themed houses would also be nice and there are FC's that use a house for RP. Why can't they operate like a mullet.