The WOL and Mass Murder

[EdwinLi]

Frankly, I think that's bullsheiss and cannot get behind that rationale. Legally, as a soldier you have an obligation to follow orders.

Morally, as a person you have an obligation to disregard tyrannical orders. If you do not, you are the one who is lacking in morals not your superiors. Some things are worth dying, or being hated by your own family and friends for.

I'm sure the "heretics" of the Dragonsong would agree.

You're ignoring the fact the garlean empire often aim at their families and friends first before killing the conscripted last. Not everyone has the belief that "Ok they are evil so I rather have my entire family, friends, and homeland get brutally killed first then myself instead of following them as a conscripted soldier" mind set you may have.

It was do what they so or everyone you love dies first then yourself last under the decree that they are rebels or be conscripted so their love onces remain unharmed even if they should die as conscripted soldiers following orders.

Many of them just wanted their loved ones to live under hope they may be spared having to follow the Garlean Empire's orders as conscripted soldiers or killed by them either through another country winning or the Garlean Empire winning even if they ended up being hated by both sides.

[KariTheFox]

Frankly, I think that's bullsheiss and cannot get behind that rationale. Legally, as a soldier you have an obligation to follow orders.

Morally, as a person you have an obligation to disregard tyrannical orders. If you do not, you are the one who is lacking in morals not your superiors. Some things are worth dying, or being hated by your own family and friends for.

I'm sure the "heretics" of the Dragonsong would agree.

What about the Garlean conscripts who were drafted from one province to fight in another, with the threat of their families back home being executed if they do not follow orders?

Do they have a moral obligation to disobey tyrannical orders, and in turn have thier families back home be killed, or they obliged to obey in order to protect thier families? There is no easy, "correct" answer. - Except that the Garlean War machine and its leaders are morally culpable for the suffering that it caused, not the average rank and file solider. (Most of the time, anyway. An individual solider COULD in fact commit horrific war crimes if they go above and beyond what they were ordered to do in terms of cruelty.)

As much as I would love a Garlean War Crimes Tribunal questline, I don't think many people would enjoy it as much as me, and I'm not sure how it could move the overall plot along.

[EdwinLi]

As much as I would love a Garlean War Crimes Tribunal questline, I don't think many people would enjoy it as much as me, and I'm not sure how it could move the overall plot along.

Interesting enough, if players remember, that back in Stormblood we have a side quest in Ala Ghiri that covered this topic involving a garlean conscripted named Baut.

He does openly admits he done horrible things under orders from his superiors when he was still a low ranking conscript soldier but once he manage to get a higher position and became the leader of the Garleans stationed in Ala Ghiri, he made active changes to policies towards treatment of people under the Garlean Controlled town of Ala Ghiri.

It resulted in both conscripts and even Garleans respecting him for improving the conditions of the town he is charged with and he made certain any mistreatment of the people in the town was punished.

However, as he admitted he still done horrible things under the command of his superiors when he was lower rank and he is only a conscript because his family and loved ones were at risk due to the Garleans taking over his home thus basically holding them hostage.

Out of fear that he may be executed, the towns people did actively hide him despite how he was willing to give himself up because they had already accepted him as one of their own due to how much he did to make the town better once he gained a high position and his position before the town was liberated was not a simple one since his family and loved ones were at risks if he done anything against the Garlean Empire or gave them a reason.

[thegreatonemal]

Interesting enough, if players remember, that back in Stormblood we have a side quest in Ala Ghiri that covered this topic involving a garlean conscripted named Baut.

He does openly admits he done horrible things under orders from his superiors when he was still a low ranking conscript soldier but once he manage to get a higher position and became the leader of the Garleans stationed in Ala Ghiri, he made active changes to policies towards treatment of people under the Garlean Controlled town of Ala Ghiri.

It resulted in both conscripts and even Garleans respecting him for improving the conditions of the town he is charged with and he made certain any mistreatment of the people in the town was punished.

However, as he admitted he still done horrible things under the command of his superiors when he was lower rank and he is only a conscript because his family and loved ones were at risk due to the Garleans taking over his home thus basically holding them hostage.

Out of fear that he may be executed, the towns people did actively hide him despite how he was willing to give himself up because they had already accepted him as one of their own due to how much he did to make the town better once he gained a high position and his position before the town was liberated was not a simple one since his family and loved ones were at risks if he done anything against the Garlean Empire or gave them a reason.

He wasn't a conscript he joined to do his twenty years of service for citizenship but his family died in a plague just when he hit that milestone. Other than him saying he was a meatshield like pretty much all conscripts are he never really talks about doing anything horrible. The citizens of the town hide him because they think the Alliance will just lock him up or kill him.

[EdwinLi]

He wasn't a conscript he joined to do his twenty years of service for citizenship but his family died in a plague just when he hit that milestone. Other than him saying he was a meatshield like pretty much all conscripts are he never really talks about doing anything horrible. The citizens of the town hide him because they think the Alliance will just lock him up or kill him.

Depends on how you will view his method of joining. Certain Garlean Soldiers that viewed their actions to join the Garlean Army as conscription because while they were offered citizenship after X or Y years of service, there was in reality no actual choice except to join unless they wanted to continue living under less rights for not being deemed Garlean Citizens or face worse consequences. However, that also depends on who was recruiting at that time and the region since we know not all garlean leadership were evil but had to manage around those that are evil.


I also already said the town intentionally hid him because they fear that the Alliance will execute him. However, if you misinterpreted that part of my post as me saying the Garleans will execute him instead then I am sorry it was not clear that I was talking about the Alliance.

[Necrotica]

The soldiers have a moral obligation to their families. Not random strangers in other countries.

The conscript that says 'fuck my family back home, I'm just gonna run away and take care of myself' would be looked upon as evil and rightly so.

[Cleretic]

I think Senti's one of the people who really struggles with understanding the dire situations some of the people we come across are in, because we personally are not in that situation.

I'm not talking 'they don't understand war IRL' or anything like that, I mean that it's hard for us to grasp just how hopeless the situation is for people in Ala Mhigo, Doma, or the First, or any number of other situations, because we're essentially turning up as their improbable last hope. We can look at Ala Mhigo and say 'yeah, this is fixable' in large part because we don't know the decades of utter hopeless domination they've lived through. We look at Eulmore and see 'this is absolutely horrific why would people agree to this' because we come from a world where there actually are better options rather than this being the only chance you've got to live in comfort.