Aggressive Gold Sinks

[Laerad3993]

Yes, I am aware of this and, yes, I do help new players. However, gold sinks by their very nature are the best way to help new players. The issue with the MBs, and why things are expensive, is generally because of monopolies or near monopolies. This rises the prices of things across the board. Trade wars lower this and help new players acquire the things they need for less gil in general. As I said, crafters get gil capped and they drop out of the market because there's no point. Thereby eliminating competition and allowing more monopolies to flourish. Crafters who are battling each other for the sell will drive down those prices.

You’re forgetting about people that actually enjoy competition and hoarding gil. I’ll tell you right now I’m sitting on more than 500m gil, with more than 15 Starlight/Valentione bardings as backup gil, and I wouldn’t sink any of it into a mount. A gil sink will do nothing for people with impulse self control.

[Alleo]

Maybe not something with such a huge price tag but even selling just minions for 10/30/50 millions would have been nice. IMO those would be better than all those exclusive real life pets and mounts that are eihter just limited for numbers or time thus are lost for all those that came later or did not just manage to snatch one. Maybe they could even say that someone could buy those pets or mount in the cash shop or for lots of Gil ingame..this way those that have the gil could just buy them and those who cant wait or simply dont have the gil (or nerve to gather it) can put it on the shop.

[Alisi]

Gathering for example players don't buy materials from other players because it's so easy just to go and get there own. You can hit ~20 items from a single gathering node a lot of the time even on the top tier materials from timed nodes.

For those who only craft a little, this may be true. For any crafter that spends even a little time on doing stuff, you're going to buy from gatherers. You simply can't gather everything on your own. I gather my timed nodes, dusts, some fish, and a select few other things but I buy everything else from the MB. I'm one of the more frugal crafters on my server and I still buy the majority of stuff from the MB. You simply can't gather all on your own. 350 gear sells well too. The stats and overmelding make some crafter better than 360 gear. xD

[Alisi]

You’re forgetting about people that actually enjoy competition and hoarding gil. I’ll tell you right now I’m sitting on more than 500m gil, with more than 15 Starlight/Valentione bardings as backup gil, and I wouldn’t sink any of it into a mount. A gil sink will do nothing for people with impulse self control.

Someone who just sits on their gil isn't the issue I have. It's people who have 500m and use that gil to control sections of the MB that I dislike. xP

[Aerlana]

during 2.0 there isnt many way to generate gils (i speak about generate, create. so no auction, that transfer already existing gils)
When 2.1 came out, it was better, but really not enough... Not enough if you see the new housing prices. housing area was empty due to really high cost.
High cost for houses + not many gil generation on servers => people prefered stack gil to buy a house than buying anything in AH => the AH price went down.
This is what happens when you dont have enough money generation on a game (and again i speak about "creation"). Good situation for new players (all low prices) but also bad for crafters. (hard to sell with good prices...)


Today we have the opposite.
A house cost less than 50m. We cant buy more than 1 house. Repair bill or teleport build is really cheap. 2.2 and after added more and more gil generation. The servers got more and more gils, as housing always get lower price.
Player got many gils. many more than before. but no way to use it.
So when they want anything in AH, they can spend many.


Good for crafters (anything they craft is high cost) bad for new players!
New players could craft also... yes. but "old" crafter already everywhere on AH, and the big crafts is not anything the new player can do.


So here we are : many money, high cost in AH, only rich people can afford it. new players cant


Money Sink could really help to regulate this.
Some people just want to have the most gils? no problem, gil sink is not things you have to buy. You prefer mass money than the 500 million mount? just dont buy it...
Not everyone can hope to afford it one day? No problem, it is just cosmetic. If people really wants this, they just have to learn how to make money and move their ass.

Gil sink is just a way to destroy money
Poor people/new players will mostly do content to generate money, until they can use AH to make money (with gathering/crafting when they have enough stuff)
Rich people will just use their money in those gil sink (if they want) and will destroy money. And so, they will spend less in AH to buy anything.

I dont understand why this game doesnt have any gil sink... it is the best way to regulate and controll AH...

edit : be generous to new people is not a real solve for this matter.
It doesnt reduce de money amount, SO doesnt reduce the prices. A group of people, with no activ crafter / rich one will always have the same matter with the big prices in AH. and anyone who come in the game to join them wont have any help, because they cant help themselves.


and gil sink can be 1 big thing to buy to a monstrous price, or many thing to more decent price
in fact, many things are better than 1 big.
more people can spend 10 m in one minion than 1 billion in 1 mount.
Have to get many things at different prices to be efficient. SE works to define what prices. They just have to see the data they have about money. (money per character, per server etc)

[ArcaviusGreyashe]

If there's no control of the marketboard, no gold sink will ever be efficient. Anyone with a brain (and that means all those people, you don't get rich being stupid) will always keep at least what they need to be rich again once they obtain everything they want from the gold sink. And then, they'll be back to inactivity until more ressources are drawn into the gold sink, which will take development time. And I'm certainly not sure that we want new content that will profit to even less people than Ultimate did, for a shorter time...

Especially if controlling the marketboard was enough to solve the price on MB problem...

The problem isn't that there's no gold sink, it's that some people were able to get that rich by exploiting the market board, not as much as others did, but they still did it. I'm noy saying you all are bad guys, you're just playing a game that doesn't appeal to many people, and that's the main issue. If there was more competition, we wouldn't need gold sink, there would just be less gils in ultra-rich people's pockets, and more in poor people's. Why that competition doesn't exist, though, is where rests the issue

[Aerlana]

you miss a thing.

the market board is the way you get most money. BUT the money NEVER come from market board. (in fact, market board destroy a small amount of money : taxes)


The money come from donjons, treasure chest and so much other way to get gils without going to market board.

So, there is more and more money on servers. More than yesterday, and there will be more tomorrow. except when big patchs are coming with new things in market, (and so really high prices, many buy so many taxes) there is never a real money destruction.

When you see that 90% people get an average amount of 1m gils, you will see prices lower than when the same 90% people get average 5m gils.

More money on server = more money to use on market = higher prices. Rich people have nothing to do with money => no car eto buy anything at insane prices...

When i read you, you say the matter is "not enough people try to use market board to do money". Yes, it would lower prices... a little, but would never stop the fact there is more, more and more money on server.


More people on market board => more offer for most thing, and less buyer. BUT for rare stuff (stuff from highest craft, rare loot from tresure chest, etc) will get even more expensive. The prices are defined by the offer, the demand... and the amount of money. If you possess 100 000 you probably not buy the now minion in AH if it costs 80K... If you possess 100m you can with no matter spend 10m to buy it.

Market board doesnt generate gils. people just try to get money from it, they will try to controll market. To get more.
Now consider anyone with 100m gils now on the game. what do with his money? nothing, totally nothing. so... use it on market to ... get more money... and doesnt care to spend 20m on a minion. If there is a 200m mount to buy he wants, maybe the 20m minion will be too expensiv in his mind...
It is exactly what we saw in 2.1
Before : normal life in market.
After : no one want to buy a minion or dress too expensiv in market because all want to buy a FC house. and all AH prices went down.

[ArcaviusGreyashe]

Yeah, but the thing is : if there was more competition, then the ultra rich would be at, let's say, a billion, and the poor at 100-200k. Then, with time, everyone could get the 750M mount, or whatever, that we spoke of earlier, and it would actually be more efficient, since even the more dedicated crafters would have to use a big part of their money to acquire it, and it would take time for them to rebuild it from "scratch". It would perpetuate the cycle of personal enrichissment, buying something great, and enrichissment again. Right now, the only thing it would do is basically make the average player poorer, and the ultra rich wouldn't see the difference, except for a fancy new mount.

The problem isn't the marketboard, the problem is the competition, once again. Eventually, we'll need gil sinks. But, if the gils were more balanced, they would be much more efficient. That's what I'm saying.

[Aerlana]

ok. i understand what you say
BUT... without gil sink, what is the use of the gils? Market board? not a use of gil, it is a transfer.

Let consider more competition, and finally, miracle, everyone is around 100m gils ready to use... ok, then? nothing to use the money...

[ArcaviusGreyashe]

That's why I dont recuse Gil sink altogether. They just need to be appropriate to be useful. Right now, they aren't, as a fix payment, but more as a tax, somehow, and that's because of the desequilibrium in personal gil.