Plot migration and why the housing problem persists, SE please start listening.

[Reyn]

Ah, but I know the reason. I'm not sure why FCs feel entitled to the larges. Smalls still give the workshop, gardening, private chambers, and so on.

New players also seem to feel real entitled to the bigger plots. There is zero reason to be mad about personal relocation other than "I'm more entitled to it than you."

It's meant to reward older players over new players I believe. If you've been playing a long time and actively trying to get a house, you could get one. I saw 2-3 plots open every week on my server (and that's just what I casually spotted from checking the aetheryte once in a while). Shirogane 1.0 EX was such a shitshow because of house flippers, and because we have all these people who've only been playing a couple months suddenly had the burning need to get in on the market (note: I knew many personally, and they would turn their nose up whenever I announced an empty plot because how dare you expect me to settle for this perfectly serviceable small). Why shouldn't the older (or less picky) house owners get better picks over someone that's only been around for a couple weeks? Yes in an ideal world everyone gets what they want (although I'm sure they'd still find something else the whine about - that it's not worth anything now that everyone can have it, probably), but idk. I find the biggest complaints about the wards/housing implementation itself come from younger peeps that've been playing less than a year.

I agree with everything you said.

There are a ton of smalls open. Private purchases will begin soon. If you really want a house, there is no excuse other than laziness to get one. As for the better plots, work your way up to them like everyone else did. When you hit 70 on your job, you start with dungeon gear, upgrade to creation, then mendacity, then you raid. You don't just get raid gear for existing. I don't know why anyone thinks housing would work any differently.

So tired of the QQing.

[Risvertasashi]

Oh the FC's probably want that large for the same reasons you do. More gardening spots, more crafting stations, more space to decorate & play with, etc...

So the question is, then, how do we decide priority?

If you're going to say "FCs because members"... well what about people paying newbies to join up into an FC with them so they can buy a house? So then, should we up the minimum member count to something like 50+ active and separate service accounts, just to ensure proper utilization of large properties?

Of course, the same people that are complaining would probably still complain, since their FCs are probably not very big....

And if it's a small FC the argument doesn't work, because tenants+friends list access gives similar (and perhaps in cases greater) shared utilization.

[Vidu]

Why? The plot they leave behind is open. Numerically, there's exactly as many plots available to FCs as if relocation were not allowed.

Ah, but I know the reason. I'm not sure why FCs feel entitled to the larges. Smalls still give the workshop, gardening, private chambers, and so on.

To be fair: One could argue that a large house grants 3 gardening plots, while a small one only allows for one - and that an FC with more members needs more gardens to ensure supply for all of them. But that really seems like only the tiniest of reasons - specially when you consider that for example both me and our FC-leader are using our "personal" gardens for the FC. So... personal house doesnt has to mean personal gardens at the same.

Personally I also made (or rather: making) the experience that having a small FC-house allows for more people to decorate - sure, not everyone at once, but it makes it easier to "take turns". My FC used to have a small house and ever so often one of us would just re-do one floor. Now that we upgraded to a mansion I dont think thats gonna be as possible since things need to match more and the item limit is tighter etc.

But yes, all important FC-functions are available with a small house - I understand that cramping 30+ people into it at once doesnt look as nice or that it doesnt feel as great sharing a small house with that amount of players, but in the end I see no real reason why an FC shouldnt be fine with a small house aswell.

Oh the FC's probably want that large for the same reasons you do. More gardening spots, more crafting stations, more space to decorate & play with, etc...

...and how is this making them more entitled to large plots than individuals?
I agree that FCs are more entitled to a house in general since there is FC-content locked behind it. But they're not entitled to prime spots or mansions - the content is avialable even with a small house. Everything else is a luxury bonus for both the solo person and the FC.
(...crafting stations are so useless, they barely count as argument - and with the NPC increase you should be able to get one of each type into a small house aswell - so basically all the benefits are there)

[Settiesama]

The fact that Individuals are allowed to relocate is just plain dumb. They have a house already and should get no priority in being allowed to move whatsoever.

So those who were forced to buy smalls when they had enough to buy mediums or larges should not be able to move because they already bought a small? Or those who bought a plot in Shirogane because the others were full, should not have the option to move to their preferred location? That's sounding so much more selfish to me. They even leave behind another open spot for someone else to buy.

[MoroMurasaki]

I agree with the overwhelming sentiment of "housing is broken" but I don't think relocation is even part of the issue.

I relocated today. I wanted to wait a while to give any FCs that wanted to purchase a house in the new wards a chance to do so and I feel like I've done that at this point. My boyfriend and I have saved up our gil since 4.1 released and today we upgraded to a medium from our small.

I certainly think it would have been okay if they'd blocked out the first 24 hours or so to FC-only purchases and then began allowing relications but I also don't think the way things were handled this time around was bad. Other than the core flaws in the system (the limited numbers of houses being key among them) I wouldn't change anything about how these new wards were implimented.

Frankly I think I did deserve an advantage as someone relocating because when I relocate there is another house being added to the market where as when someone buys their first plot it's just taking from the already limited supply. I do wish there was no timer on the plot being relocated from - those should at least be up for grabs to FCs immediately.

[Risvertasashi]

But yes, all important FC-functions are available with a small house

Yeah. I understand these advantages. But before it was complaints that "We can't do FC crafting/buffs/airships/etc", which is now a complete nonissue. Every FC, right now, can get access to these things.

Also I sincerely doubt most FCs have 30+ members online concurrently and around the house. If you are one of those few then yes, I do feel for you. But I really doubt there's very many in that boat... and most just want a larger house for the luxury of it.

As others have said, complaining about relocation is an extension of: "But I wanted that plot and someone took it even though there are other plots available!" I'm not particularly sympathetic to this complaint.

[InkstainedGwyn]

So those who were forced to buy smalls when they had enough to buy mediums or larges should not be able to move because they already bought a small? Or those who bought a plot in Shirogane because the others were full, should not have the option to move to their preferred location? That's sounding so much more selfish to me. They even leave behind another open spot for someone else to buy.

This. And if (a large if, I know, because SE tends to switch focuses every patch) they continue this routine, it means that ppl can buy a house, even if it's not 'the one they want', and then they have a better chance at getting 'the one they want' when the next set goes live and they can transfer, instead of just having to fight the 5,000-15,000 player rush every single time. I feel like that's a worthwhile trade. My friend and I got a small in 4.1, although we had more than enough for a large, and we upgraded to our 'dream plot' (a medium) in 4.2. I hope that everyone who is able to get a new house in 4.2 will have the similar opportunity to upgrade the next time they give us more housing.

[Vidu]

Yeah. I understand these advantages. But before it was complaints that "We can't do FC crafting/buffs/airships/etc", which is now a complete nonissue. Every FC, right now, can get access to these things.

Also I sincerely doubt most FCs have 30+ members online concurrently and around the house. If you are one of those few then yes, I do feel for you. But I really doubt there's very many in that boat... and most just want a larger house for the luxury of it.

As others have said, complaining about relocation is an extension of: "But I wanted that plot and someone took it even though there are other plots available!" I'm not particularly sympathetic to this complaint.

Oh yeah, I totally agree - I hope that was clear from my posts and that you're not disagreeing with me here xD

This whole thread really reminds me of this fairytale with the fisher who catches the magic fish and the fish tells him "If you let me live, I'll grant you a wish!"
And since the fisher is a kind old man, he lets the fish live even without wishing anything. But when he goes home and tells his wife she goes "Oh, you should have asked for a better house and some gold!" (I'm not making that part about the house up! The person who thought of the fairytale did! Quite ironic...)
So the fisher goes back the next day, finds the fish again and tells him what the wife asked for. And teh fish grants the wish.
When the man comes home, he finds his little fishing-hut transformed into a nice little house... and his wife unhappy "If the fish could do that, he could have given us an even better house! Go back tomorrow and ask for that!"
...and he does...
And that goes one for a while until the fish is fed up and takes everything away from them. The end.

Doubt thats gonna happen here, but my sympathy lies with the fish...

[Settiesama]

This whole thread really reminds me of this fairytale with the fisher who catches the magic fish and the fish tells him "If you let me live, I'll grant you a wish!"

Is it sad that.. Instead of the "If you keep begging you'll end up with nothing" moral of the story, I end up seeing "Never listen to your wife" as the moral instead. :x

[DeaconMoore]

So the question is, then, how do we decide priority?

If you're going to say "FCs because members"... well what about people paying newbies to join up into an FC with them so they can buy a house? So then, should we up the minimum member count to something like 50+ active and separate service accounts, just to ensure proper utilization of large properties?

Of course, the same people that are complaining would probably still complain, since their FCs are probably not very big....

And if it's a small FC the argument doesn't work, because tenants+friends list access gives similar (and perhaps in cases greater) shared utilization.

*smh*

Your assertion was that fc's should be content with smalls, my comment was pointing out why they wouldn't be and would desire a large like you.

The question of priority has already been answered, first come first serve, and with this patch no new individual players thus allowing FC's more of a priority until they unlock it for all.

Arguing over utilization is also pointless.

The real question is when are we going to see a real fix and enough housing for all FC's and individuals?