Byakko... HM or EX ?

[Nihility]

difficulty has a rubberband effect because the devs spend too much time listening to a whiny internet audience
shinryu was "too hard!" so now byakko is "too easy!" it just goes back and forth

I think with the way people are nowadays any content developer needs to take in that the unhappy are about 1000% louder than the happy people

[loreleidiangelo]

The distinct difference that you don't seem to be getting that the Tank LB doesn't let us ignore the tiger mechanic entirely. We still have to do it in the first phase whether we like it or not. Meanwhile Soar could be skipped in the first phase by high DPS, which I'm almost certain is the part that devs were referring to with the comment about an inexperienced programmer. Nobody learned to do Soar and as soon as people had to do it groups fell apart. This isn't happening with Byakko.

Just wanted to make that clear.

? Groups are absolutely falling apart if they don't have tank LB3 for the second add phase, are you kidding? Why do you think "no double jobs" is the new "skip Soar or disband"?

[Vaer]

The distinct difference that you don't seem to be getting that the Tank LB doesn't let us ignore the tiger mechanic entirely. We still have to do it in the first phase whether we like it or not. Meanwhile Soar could be skipped in the first phase by high DPS, which I'm almost certain is the part that devs were referring to with the comment about an inexperienced programmer. Nobody learned to do Soar and as soon as people had to do it groups fell apart. This isn't happening with Byakko.

Just wanted to make that clear.

IIRC Tank LB2 was used on the soar after broken seal, not the first one. Wasn't a fix all like tank LB3 in Byakko (I've actually been in a group where all 4 dps were dead in that phase due to failed gale/orbs and still cleared it using tank LB3 and raising people during the LB time, lol), since sometimes people still died because people were that bad at soar but sort of similar situation.

[Sacred_Nym]

? Groups are absolutely falling apart if they don't have tank LB3 for the second add phase, are you kidding? Why do you think "no double jobs" is the new "skip Soar or disband"?

If groups fail because of a lack of Tank LB3, it's because the group got lazy to do a mechanic for the second time in a fight. If groups failed Zurvan because they didn't skip, it was because nobody there knew how to do soar and actively refused to learn it. There's quite a difference.
Also maybe it's an unpopular opinion, but I don't understand why "no double jobs" isn't the standard as well an option in PF. I mean the LB penalties on high end content are there for a reason but we have to police it ourselves. I honestly don't see why it's being compared to "Skip Soar".

IIRC Tank LB2 was used on the soar after broken seal, not the first one. Wasn't a fix all like tank LB3 in Byakko (I've actually been in a group where all 4 dps were dead in that phase due to failed gale/orbs and still cleared it using tank LB3 and raising people during the LB time, lol), since sometimes people still died because people were that bad at soar but sort of similar situation.

Soar was skipped in the first phase and then tank LB'd in the second for the express purpose of nobody having to learn the mechanic. You can't skip or Tank LB the first tiger in Byakko, so you can't avoid learning the mechanic or how it works. That's all I was trying to say.

[RLofOBFL]

I must admit the mechanic actually becomes quite hard if you don't tank lb. I think a doable alternative is to LB the add or ranged lb both. I dont think that mechanic can be completed w.o any lb casually at our gear level. If we couldn't just LB cheese it, that mechanic would be pretty rough and the entire fight would be hardr . And I have a bunch of orange dps, tanks, and healers in my party so it's not quite just big deeps.

[alimdia]

I must admit the mechanic actually becomes quite hard if you don't tank lb. I think a doable alternative is to LB the add or ranged lb both. I dont think that mechanic can be completed w.o any lb casually at our gear level. If we couldn't just LB cheese it, that mechanic would be pretty rough and the entire fight would be hardr . And I have a bunch of orange dps, tanks, and healers in my party so it's not quite just big deeps.

People did it just fine before tank LB strategy was found out.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

I've definitely seen people make mistakes on that fight. What's funnier is that the worst players I run into in there seem to be players rocking full crafted sets that somehow even underperform compared to people below the ilvl requirement for it.

Are you saying gear doesn't equal skill?!

/dramaticfaint

[Ayer2015]

People did it just fine before tank LB strategy was found out.

Groups were doing the tank LB3 on the first day....

[Theodric]

I quite like where it is in terms of difficulty.

It's very 'middle of the road' which is exactly the sort of content I want more of in FFXIV.

For those who want something tougher? Well, that's what Savage is for. Those who manage to complete that and need an even larger challenge have Ultimate Coil to tackle.

[Kazrah]

Are you saying gear doesn't equal skill?!

/dramaticfaint

It wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't so insanely consistent.