These warrior changes are great

[Metalwrath]

Warrior in 2.0 was way worse than PLD.
The idea back then of relying on a huge HP pool wit Warrior to survive big hits instead of having defensive cooldowns might have sounded good on paper but in reality it was only good for pulling big packs of trash.Also if you remember original overpower animation.It took about 3 seconds to finish.
Warrior was being avoided for runs in Titan hard mode as MT and all the coils in any tank position.
He was however very popular for tome farming.The infamous wanderers palace setup.Warrior + black mage and bard and pull everything at once.(Which led to bard getting nerfed into the ground)

[Xan_Kriegor]

Does this whole discussion about which job in the past was broken or not really matters?
I just wish they would leave jobs as balanced as possible in the current version, regardless who was better in the past.

[Xtrasweettea]

[...]

It's surreal because I believe you sit to the right of the bell curve when it comes to player skill on WAR. I believe the changes SE made were for those who sat on the bell-curve and slightly to the left-of-center. Since you are more skilled than what was envisioned by SE in regards to these changes, it will be surreal

You posting this makes me want to try it and make sure I can execute this when I run into a similar situation. Same thing with trying 8 Steel Cyclones on pulls. How much healing did you get out of that, by the way? Was it enough to allow the Healer to go hog-wild on DPS for that burst window?

Thanks for sharing this. Hopefully if we share more stories like this, we can move the bell-curve related to WAR player skill more to the right (assuming SE doesn't nerf this).

[InfiniDragon]

I agree, the changes feel good and make WAR way more accessible. I think Steel Cyclone and Inner Beast healing is going to get nerfed though (or maybe not since it's on WAR and not PLD or DRK) because it's nuts how much self-healing they get now.

Why can't SE put as much care into all their jobs as they do for this one? XD

[Aana]

You posting this makes me want to try it and make sure I can execute this when I run into a similar situation. Same thing with trying 8 Steel Cyclones on pulls. How much healing did you get out of that, by the way? Was it enough to allow the Healer to go hog-wild on DPS for that burst window?

Thanks for sharing this. Hopefully if we share more stories like this, we can move the bell-curve related to WAR player skill more to the right (assuming SE doesn't nerf this).

Executing 8 isn't really hard. you get 5 for free. 100 gauge+infuriate is the last 3. You get a minimum of 6 with IR+Infuriate, 7 EZ if you had 50+ before pull. 8 you have to have some prep for 100 gauge, but that's not really necessary for a regular pull.

It was my 1st dungeon so I still have some old muscle memory to break. On big pulls I popped vengeance both times when I had Zerk up and was full HP until cyclone spam was over, but that was with an extra 30% vengeance mitigation. Ive only done the 1 dungeon since patch so I couldn't say if it could entirely stand alone with no CDs or outside heals personally. But its still a ton regardless.

I have 1st raid tonight. Not sure if were doing sigma or byakko but I'll have some anecdotal stuff after that and some more dungeons I'm sure.

[Deceptus]

Enjoy it while it lasts. There is ZERO chance this stands. It's way too powerful and way too fun.

[Shinkyo]

4.2 WAR is the strongest the class has ever been. It just may not be the most fun for some people. I personally like it

Really the only thing we have lost since OP 3.x is the 10% party mitigation from path.
In every other aspect, WAR got buffed hard.

[ULoki]

You are literally a walking GOD in dungeon...great balancing.

[TouchandFeel]

it's nuts how much self-healing they get now.

Agreed that it is ridiculous now, however I am somewhat hesitant to see the devs just take a straight nerf-bat to the healing for those abilities. It's a fine line to walk to make the self-healing for them not overpowered because of IR spam, while not making it overly weak when used outside of IR spam.

I kind of feel that they have created a situation with this where they can balance for one or the other use situation, but not for both. I wonder if maybe the best way to actually "fix" the problem that they just created would be to just simply undo the change that seems to be the central cause, and just make it so that you can't use IR in Defiance and then put the self-heal amount for Steel Cyclone back to where it was in 4.1.

In fact this reminds me a lot of Blood Price. It used to be super powerful in large-pack pulls, essentially being an inexhaustible source of MP. The devs saw this, as they should have, as being too powerful so they took the easy route and just straight reduced the MP returned.
Now Blood Price is fairly balanced in large packs but is greatly under-tuned for small packs and single-target fights.
Another situation of can tune and balance for one situation or the other, but not for both.

I mean, there may be a happy middle-ground that could be reached by straight reducing the self-heal on those abilities where it is still very powerful in IR spam just not as much as now, while being a bit weaker outside of the spam and it is generally accepted in regards to balance for those abilities that players will be using them both ways so they sort of even each other out. I guess it is possible, but again that is a very fine line to walk and I have my doubts whether the dev team could necessarily achieve that and doubly so whether the community would accept it.

[Reynhart]

I'm struggling to find information on Storms Path from 2.0, but I remember plenty of arguments of what should WAR do as OT, which included the idea of alternating between Path and Eye, when not MTing. (Instead of BB for the higher DPS)
Path did offer support to the rest of the group, but if it wasnt -10% dmg, I'm fairly sure it helpped do something to lower dmg, otherwise it had no use.

You can check the patch notes directly at the lodestone, it's baffling how much WAR was buffed at 2.1. Frankly, I think they overdid it and WAR was OP since then. But since we only had two tank jobs and frequently two tank spots, it didn't really click during ARR.

(And PLDs did NOT have a CD for every Death Sentance, it was impossible w/o how often she used that attack. They can survive the attack, but were likely to die right after the attack.)

At 30s between each Death Sentence, you can use Rampart for the 1st, Sentinel for the 2nd, Hallowed for the 3rd, Rampart for the 4th, Bulwark+Fortress for the 5th. And if your group faces more than 5 Death Sentences, you'd probably die of enrage anyway.