The time has come to get rid of enrage timers

[RiyahArp]

There are a few dungeon bosses with soft enrages like running out of some kind of interactable item or stacking vuln up on the party, if we had more of that maybe people would be more ready for a hard enrage.

The later trials do have soft and hard enrages. Ravana is soft, Bismarck has both (hard with dragons, soft via island durability) and sus ex's sword phase are hard. Shin hard's add phase has enrage too, you saw it a lot when it launched and people died alot because the safe areas seemed a lot tighter. But you'd need to make all of them harder, because they are easy enough to be carried through.

This is the big problem; you make it have enough teeth to be a teaching moment, you get a lot of wipes and deaths overall, and not a few abandons.

[zuzu-bq]

Remove everything else too. We don't need to perform rotations anyways. Just let us play DDR and spam one button until the boss dies. Please make it happen SE. /s

[KDSilver]

=> When you realize it might really be the time to stop reading post on official forum.

[Alael]

this entire topic make no sense lol, Rid of enrage timer? and what you want the boss to kill himself with the press of one button next?

[Zarkovitch]

I need my enrage timer to die for cutseen reason!

[Tridus]

Because every fight will be reduced to simply be a war of attrition. Bring all three healers, Red Mage and Summoner then just Raise each and every time someone dies until the boss eventually keels over. Without an arbitrary timer of some sort, there isn't any risk. That average group you cited? They wouldn't beat Neo because of skill. They beat him by merely throwing themselves at him long enough with reckless abandon. Dedicated DPS jobs outside the aforementioned would be borderline useless. Why bring a Dragoon when an extra tank will provide mitigation? DPS doesn't matter anymore. So there's no trade off.

The reason DPS is such a focal point in this game has little to do with enrage timers, which are often quite forgiving. The DPS mindset stems from how little you actually need to heal or mitigate. No other MMO I can think of allows a healer to spend upwards of 80% dealing damage. You want to incentivize tank stance more often? Make enmity matter, lessen cooldowns or outright take away immunities. Tanks frequently rotate into tank stance in Ultimate. Why? They don't always have CDs to mitigate the sheer amount of incoming damage. Until tanks need to be in tank stance or healers need to heal, damage will always be the superior option.

This. It's utterly baffling to me that on my not very good PLD, I can do my enmity combo three times, switch to Sword Oath, and never think about it again for an entire expert boss and a shocking amount of a Deltascape normal boss (or all of said bosses if the OT is kind and uses Shirk). Like, what? Isn't that supposed to be my job? When the bar is so low that even an occasional alt-tank that doesn't outgear anything or anyone can beat it that easily, what am I supposed to try and do except more DPS?

Enmity and healing are both fixed quantity requirements. You need X of both of them to hold enemies on you and make people not die. Any extra is superfluous. More DPS makes fights end faster, which means fewer chances for a mistake to cause a wipe. You can always use more of that.

I think you're bang on about the problem here.

[Orbus]

You want to incentivize tank stance more often? Make enmity matter, lessen cooldowns or outright take away immunities. Tanks frequently rotate into tank stance in Ultimate. Why? They don't always have CDs to mitigate the sheer amount of incoming damage. Until tanks need to be in tank stance or healers need to heal, damage will always be the superior option.

They also need to stop giving more and more enmity reduction skills to every class.
Every single caster and healer has access to two through cross role actions which is pretty absurd right there, and every physical class has access to at least one with most of them having a second one specific to their class.
This practically begs the tank to hyper focus on dps.
After all, why should the tank worry about enmity when everyone else can do that for him and without sacrificing anyone's damage?
This is completely backwards logic towards a role.

[HyoMinPark]

They also need to stop giving more and more enmity reduction skills to every class.
Every single caster and healer has access to two through cross role actions which is pretty absurd right there, and every physical class has access to at least one with most of them having a second one specific to their class.
This practically begs the tank to hyper focus on dps.
After all, why should the tank worry about enmity when everyone else can do that for him and without sacrificing anyone's damage?
This is completely backwards logic towards a role.

Uh... healers have one enmity dump: Lucid Dreaming. They don't have access to anything other than that.

That being said, I disagree with this. I like that enmity is a party responsibility and not a burden placed solely on a tank.

I know a lot of people who frequent these or any forums on the game are pretty hardcore players, but the majority of people sub'd to ffxiv are casual and / or just enjoy hanging out in a final fantasy world with others experiencing content.

Yeah you shouldn't be undergeared or have no idea what you are doing but these hardcore dps checks belong in endgame hardcore type content and not in the regular game.

I think 24-Mans should have an Enrage timer of sorts. As well as the 8-man normal modes. Once you've been in a 15-minute Construct 7 or a 13-minute Thundergod Cid or a 15-minute Guardian normal mode, you start to think they should have some sort of timer on them. Nothing super strict, but I don't think these fights should surpass 11~12 minutes. I get the impression that a lot of people don't care about damage at the upper levels because so many things don't stress doing decent amounts of it. And then these players go into EX or Savage, and complain when they are suddenly expected to beat an Enrage timer.

The first boss of Dun Scaith has a hard enrage, and I think that's quite neat.

[Dualgunner]

They also need to stop giving more and more enmity reduction skills to every class.
Every single caster and healer has access to two through cross role actions which is pretty absurd right there, and every physical class has access to at least one with most of them having a second one specific to their class.
This practically begs the tank to hyper focus on dps.
After all, why should the tank worry about enmity when everyone else can do that for him and without sacrificing anyone's damage?
This is completely backwards logic towards a role.

My point of view: I like things like this, because they emphasize team play by having players in one role actively helping the players in another role. Tanks and healers can focus on DPS (thus helping the DPS role) because DPS mitigate aggro and use mitigative cooldowns (anything from second wind, addle, apoc/palisade) to reduce aggro gen needed and healing needed (helping the healing / tanking roles). This synergy of teamwork is in my opinion much better than a rigid "Tanks must tank, healers must heal, and that is all God wrote was good" view.

[Ilan]

They also need to stop giving more and more enmity reduction skills to every class.
Every single caster and healer has access to two through cross role actions which is pretty absurd right there, and every physical class has access to at least one with most of them having a second one specific to their class.
This practically begs the tank to hyper focus on dps.
After all, why should the tank worry about enmity when everyone else can do that for him and without sacrificing anyone's damage?
This is completely backwards logic towards a role.

Nope they should give them more and directly implement it into the skills so the lazy people use emnity reduction without pressing a button.
Healers have Lucid Dreaming and thats it, nice try.
Tanks can only focus on dps if the party lets him and thats rarely the case if said tank does duties with randoms. There is also nothing wrong with tanks that have their focus on dps if they are doing mechanics right because emnity is the job of the whole party and not just the job of the tank.