Adressing the roots of the housing problem

[Melichoir]

Ok, so whats the problem? Im having a hardtime figuring this out cause heres the info Ive heard:

1) 1 House 'type' (private/FC) per world PER ACCOUNT (so no alts). Individuals may only own 1 private and 1 FC house.
2) Theyll be adding around 1400 new plots per server essentially.
3) FCs will be allowed to purchase first, then individual purchases will open up.
4) New rules will apply going forward.

Depending your server, are people anticipating 1400 FCs to spring up and buy houses? 1400 nwe houses popping up is a helluva lot. Is it goign to be all in Shirogane? No. So are people not going to get teh 'exact' house they want? Yes. Thats expected. These changes enable FCs to get housing first, THEN individuals, which is something I hvae no problem with. FCs should get the pick of the litter when it comes to Housing, broadly speaking. Then itll become open to everyone. And chances are good that theyll say "Hey, on So-and-So date, individual purchases for housing will go out!" So its not going to be a random unannounced time most likely.

So assuming that 400 houses get bought up for FCs, that leaves a thousand open houses. Now depending on your realm size, thats a huge deal. Realm average ACTIVE player base varies between 6k-13k, depending where you look. So an extra 1000 houses can be quite a lot depending the server. Even at its worst, 13k, another 1000 houses for individuals is gonna be 7% of the active server population. At its best, its near 15%.

"But the Resellers!!!" What about them? You cant own more than one private and one FC per world now, so if you already own a house, by how the rules look, your SoL. You cant buy a new one. Even if you can, ok so you own a second one. Derp, sucks but Resellers arent going to buy up that many houses as FC houses. And you want to know how you screw resellers who want to make fake FCs on the housing market? By stalling when individuals can buy houses, making it so theres PLENTY of other land to buy so that resellers are fighting in a market with to much supply. Yeah, tis not going to be widespread abuse on the whole reseller point. Good luck trying to sell a Primo FC house when there are 143 other plots around, and you can only buy 1 FC house and 1 Personal house at a time per server.

So, is this the worst thing ever? No. Are they likely to continue adding housing to the game? Yes. Should it be easier now to get a house this time around with new rules in place? Yes. Are you gonna have to really try for it still? Sure. Are you going to get exactly the house you want in Shirogane? Maybe.

But seriously though, please stop acting like this is the worst thing ever and does nothing to help. It may not be the most ideal of solutions currently, but you better be happy its something. Cause the alternative is SE just saying "Screw it, I dont care about your housing needs" and just ignoring you guys.

[Darrcyphfeid]

And chances are good that theyll say "Hey, on So-and-So date, individual purchases for housing will go out!" So its not going to be a random unannounced time most likely.

They did the opposite of this Christmas 2015. They gave a date and a time for FC/relocations already.

There's nothing to indicate, beyond your willingness to trust SE, that they will do an announcement and not just have people do another around of potentially sitting around for 9 hours or more again.

"But the Resellers!!!" What about them? You cant own more than one private and one FC per world now, so if you already own a house, by how the rules look, your SoL. You cant buy a new one. Even if you can, ok so you own a second one. Derp, sucks but Resellers arent going to buy up that many houses as FC houses. And you want to know how you screw resellers who want to make fake FCs on the housing market? By stalling when individuals can buy houses, making it so theres PLENTY of other land to buy so that resellers are fighting in a market with to much supply. Yeah, tis not going to be widespread abuse on the whole reseller point. Good luck trying to sell a Primo FC house when there are 143 other plots around, and you can only buy 1 FC house and 1 Personal house at a time per server.

This is a bit murky because you're stuck somewhere between "owning" and "purchasing," without fully nailing either of them.

The fact of the matter is that, if I (as an individual) were to re-up some old accounts, and spend a couple days making investments (time, mostly), I could very much use five service accounts to buy 7 (8 if I were to pawn off my current FC house) FC houses on Feb 6th. There's a very clear workaround in there. Depending on server stability, I'd wager I could nab 4 or 5 medium/large houses if I were so inclined*. This is anecdotal, but I'm familiar with two different groups of people on Faerie that resell houses. I don't know them personally, and do not know what they plan to do (or if they care at all), but the potential for abuse is high.

* I'm not! Put the pitchforks down!

So, is this the worst thing ever? No. Are they likely to continue adding housing to the game? Yes. Should it be easier now to get a house this time around with new rules in place? Yes. Are you gonna have to really try for it still? Sure. Are you going to get exactly the house you want in Shirogane? Maybe.

1) Depends on how invested you are in this housing thing. Not all houses are created equally - if they were, we would be in instanced housing - and that inequality will be a bigger or lesser deal depending on who you are. Housing is aesthetic (glamour), and glamour is endgame.
2) Yes. But not for a really long time. This is probably going to be it for 4.X, meaning you have over a year to wait for more (or two months for a select few demolitions).
3) Debatable. I'd argue "No" since, to get a house now, you have to do it personally. You can't get any friends to help (by also trying to buy, and relinquishing later to give it to you). And realistically you only have one chance at one placard since everyone will be standing at various placards based on their amount of investment in #1.
5) Because of relocations, and depending on your server (RIP Balmung), the answer to this is you're probably not getting a Shirogane plot period. Most individuals that relocate, which again they will do before individual purchases are enabled, will be relocating into Shirogane. Most houses available when individual purchasing is enabled will be in the Goblet, following past trends (Shiro >>> Mist >/= LB >> Goblet).

It may not be the most ideal of solutions currently, but you better be happy its something.

I'll respectfully decline. "It's better than nothing" is such a low bar, and I'm not even sure they've managed to clear that after drumming up excitement for housing, and then failing to deliver, in two consecutive patches.



Also, as this thread is now located in the Housing forum where I'll be preaching to the choir and markedly fewer people will see it, my interest in posting more has bottomed out.

[Besame]

This whole process is such a cluster.... I was thinking of relocation but I have decided to keep my Grade 2-medium in the beds.

[Cylla]

This whole process is such a cluster.... I was thinking of relocation but I have decided to keep my Grade 2-medium in the beds.

I've been trying since the release of SB to get a large house. When the relocation system went in, I was like, "Sweet! Now can get a large hopefully." I didn't care where I got it. But nope, the servers bottle necked on the new housing release and Balmung was cleared out all over the board within five minutes.
Now coming to 4.2 and I have very little faith still in getting a large or even a medium. I'd settle for even just that but I'm on Balmung, so yeah...
Already people out to abuse the system by making FC's just so they can get their hands on a house.

Make me wish SE hadn't said anything at all until patch day.

[RayneLittlewinkle]

Make me wish SE hadn't said anything at all until patch day.

Exactly. They shouldn't of said anything until like the day or two BEFORE the 24 hour maintenance They apologized to us about 4.1 and then said they would would make it fair and withhold information. They've already broken that by pushing out personal people from buying a home and also from giving out info early.

People think 1400 homes is plentiful but I think they under estimate how quick they go on Balmung.

[Cylla]

Yep!
Now you got people leaving FC's to make their own by either gathering up 4 random people or friends and rushing to get up in the ranks and points to buy a house, only adding more to the chaos. I'm honestly getting tired of it. I know there more information their supposedly withholding until patch notes/patch day but unless it to tell us that a lottery system was put in or something, it just going to be the same bs all over again. What going to happen when they do let people start buying personal housing? There will be none to buy!!

[Melichoir]

1) Ive no real reason to believe that SE will create a staggered purchase period and NOT tell us when the window for independant buyers opens up. It will most likely be made known in a small patch note. As in "Hey, after this minor maintanence, youll be able to purchase privately." It would be hugely retarded on SEs part to just open up individual purchases without any form of notification on a staggered purchase period. They have problems, but theyre not diabolical retards.

2) Yes, if you were inclined to go through THAT much work to mass buy houses, yeah you could work aroudn the restrictions. Thing is, most people are not going to go that length. There may be a handful of people who will actually use multiple accounts to get multiple houses. And theyer going to try and do this WHILE actual functional FCs are making their purchases. Are they gonna be duel boxing too? Or grabbing 7-8 friends to run in at the same time as FCs to get that thing?

Just because there are work arounds doesnt mean the system is bad. If you have to expend a lot of effort to do things, it shrinks the pool of people being able to do it easily, thus opening it up more for people doing it by legitimate means. Meaning, chances are youre going to find enough re-sellers be able to purchase FC housing competitively with actual FCs is likely to be small. Im not saying there wont be resellers, Im saying that given current restrictions pushed forward, youre not going to see it be this huge issue. Itll be there, itll suck for some cases, but its not going to be the 'world-ending' issue that people make resellers out to be. Abuse potential is there, though I dont believe it to be "high".

3) Glamours is end game, but that still doesnt make this system the worst thing ever. Its a decent step. They will add more housing over time. Maybe not right now, but theres no saying they wont add another round before the next xpac either. Its going to be EASIER cause they cut down on the average reseller nonsense, and there is a slightly LESS demand now for housing simply because people who wanted houses and got them dont need them currently, and server populations did not increase to overcome that difference. You may compete with getting a particular house, sure, but the number of people wanting a house should be less currently than it was when Shirogane opened up. And as I point out, 1400 new houses per server is not nothing to sneeze at. In some cases, thats almost a fourth of the server population. Assuming you wont get a house means you wont get a house. "Im never going to get the thing I want, so I will not try." Its a self-fulfilling prophecy. Youre not guarenteed a particular plot of land. Thats never been a feature. You have to compete with other players for specifics. But the idea you wont get a house being guaranteed? No, thats bleak thinking.

4) Disagree and decline all you want. The simple truth is this system being put forward is a step up from what it was. You can hate that its not being implemented in a manner you deem fit, but that doesnt make this a bad implementation.

[Amomomo]

The simple truth is this system being put forward is a step up from what it was. You can hate that its not being implemented in a manner you deem fit, but that doesnt make this a bad implementation.

I strongly agree that though 4.2 changes are not perfect, they are nonetheless improvements. The main purpose of this fixes is to answer housing SUPPLY issues, especially for FCs who have never owned before. Regardless of dummy FCs, number of new small houses should be able to satisfy majority of this issue, in addition to the surplus plots freed up by FC/personal relocation. Yes, amount of housing may still yet be % of the total player population, but please do keep in mind that not all players wants a house!

4.2 does NOT, however, cater for the demands for medium/large housing (only a few hundred in total per world). If you are screaming for the "fairness" of owning larger plots, then 4.2 is not for you. There will be blood, sweat and tears in the upcoming 4.2 war for larger housing (between FCs and personal relocators).

For those arguing for instanced housing and/or complete revamp of the housing system: have you any idea of the amount of resources that will be required? If so, that means every other contents will need to be pushed back. There was plenty of this argument back in 4.1 housing rush. Yes, there is no denial that the housing system may be a mistake from the get-go, but please do not deny dev team's efforts and bash them for trying the fix the issue alongside their packed content release schedules.

Regarding post-4.2 reselling: yes, it will continue - dodgy practices will always find new methods to avoid the system. Several methods can be 1) as mentioned, buy from dummy FCs, 2) sell relocation plots instead of relinquish (making med/large the primary target for horders), 3) having peeps trading/cancelling placard transaction until housing relinquish timer ends, etc etc etc. However, because of the extra effort, the number of house resellers abusing the system WILL BE CUT DOWN, which is the original intent of this 4.2 update. In fact, the new changes will allow diligent players who consistently looking for empty plots better chances in acquiring a house fair and square (regardless of plot desirability).

[Acilith]

Not only are there not enough houses, there's not enough larger sized houses. So even if we did have the proper amount of wards, people would just be popping new wards forever wanting that largest possible plot. I think the only fix is instanced personal housing, maybe leave the wards for FCs.