Please make it a requirement to level PLD or/and Warrior before accessing Dark Knight

[Mavrias]

Im not talking about Darks missing a thing or 2.Im arguing about them not even knowing the basics of tanking at high levels.Again you're just arguing for the sake or arguing.You seem to be obvlious to the fact that it's an issue.

You're arguing about them needing a learning process but yet want to disagree with me suggesting a better learning process.
Dark starts at level 30 not level 1.There are key parts at lower levels as a tank being missed out on this.I would have thought that maybe as a level 70 warrior you would know this but maybe you leveld your tank through Fates i dunno.

Level 30 DRK is fundamentally no different than a really edgy PLD. If someone isnt reading their tooltips at level 30, theyre not doin it at 1 to 29 either. If you dont wanna take the time to instruct them or you're too scared to, that's a you problem.

[Ekimmak]

Does levelling a white mage to fifty mean that I'm not going to get an AST that insists on pulling everything in the dungeon on a PLD that's barely meeting gear requirements? Does levelling BRD mean I have nothing to learn about MCH? If you want someone to do a better job, offer to teach them. If they don't want advice, then it'll come to bite them eventually.

I doubt they can be as terrible as a level 25 gladiator in Hyur gear.

[whiskeybravo]

Are the HW jobs no longer locked behind lv50? I thought you had to at least had 1 lv50 and access to HW before you could unlock them. Of course it's entirely possible they changed it by now.

If it is still that way, that's really plenty of time for even a dps to understand the basics of good/bad tanking just from 35 levels of observation.

But as some others have said, adding another arbitrary leveling requirement doesn't really solve the problem. The only thing that really does is more experience and talking with people, getting on the forums etc. Of course it's true the game doesn't do a spectacular job of training people on their jobs, but they really shouldn't have to. People are either interested in getting better or they're not. Anyone who is interested in getting better will ask questions, search around online, read/watch guides, etc, etc. Other people simply won't, more robust in-game training most likely won't help them.

So it really just boils down to setting the expectation that most people are going to half-ass it. Then you can be pleasantly surprised when they don't

[NozDeathlos]

I mained SMN before trying DRK. Back then PAL or WAR didnt appeal to me. I did hall of novice training 5 times and stark zodiark videos before trying satasha, and did satasha 5 times before the next dungeon and repeat the process. Now i main DRK and second main War

Had the game force me to play tank classes before unlocking DRK i would probably have never tried tanking. It would probably a better requirement to finish hall of novice training before you can enter dungeons

[LeeraSorlan]

Dude if u get a drk that cant spam unleash/abysall in aoe or power slash combo in single target at lv 67, there a lot more going wrong with him than him not going pld or war first.

Nonsense post, drk isnt easier or harder than the other two

[Wintersandman]

The only thing I will agree with is level 60+ players who won't listen to feedback. I actually ask permission to give feedback before doing so as I have been flamed before or flat out ignored.

[Almandaragal]

What you're describing are players that are "bad" at the role, not a problem that is specific to "Dark Knights who haven't leveled another tank class".

I actually tried to go PLD first. Made it to 32, got kinda bored with how crappy the damage was yet how... non-tanky I seemed to be in even just world play, and instead did something else. Read a bit here and there about bits of the DRK storyline, and went "now THIS I have to play, that sounds like a job story worth progressing". So I did. And I read up on the basics. I went into DRK knowing I would be playing a "lesser" tank, that CD management would be especially key since I would have less, and one only useful on magic, so more like 2 less on a lot of things prior to 70, and that MP management would be a big deal. Still leveled it primarily through squadrons to 50. Then I went back to Brayflox and ran the dungeons up with actual people to learn it, continued and still do continue to do Leveling and 50/60 roulettes with it.

I asked and still do ask for feedback, if my party would prefer I do anything different. If I mess up, I apologize, ask for feedback, etc. While I don't feel comfortable dropping Grit often except on certain bosses or if a healer really seems to have me solid, if we wipe it's most definitely not due to me overpulling or not using CDs. Will I ever be your 11 minute dungeon guide, pulling wall to wall? Nope. But I'll pull a couple packs at a time if we don't seem to have some new/low-geared party members for the instance. People can rarely think of anything they would have liked me doing differently, and healers have commented multiple times that they enjoyed the run because it wasn't stressful, but it wasn't slow either.

None of that crap I did came from leveling a Gladiator, then PLD all of two levels. That came from who I am and how I approach things as a player. I try to be a considerate player because I believe that's what I believe to be right at a personal level. Not everyone does, or not everyone catches on or adapts to certain styles of play as easily. I found Sohm Al much easier to tank the first couple times than I did when I first healed it, by far. I know exactly why, but some people would be confused, because "wtf, that's easy to heal" or "really? I hate tanking that one", etc.

Outside of having no "actual" reason or precedent, I just don't see the point. Someone who is going to struggle with tanking is going to struggle with tanking in any class. You could actually argue that they would struggle more on DRK after dealing with the others, since they are in better situations CD wise. Then this player would get to a tank that, prior to 70 especially, is obviously considered "inferior", and not be able to perform because the tools are... of lower quality.

So no, I'm not really seeing any validity here. Had I been gated from DRK until I got PLD or WAR to 50, there would be some 170ish roulette parties out there who would have been waiting longer for a tank because I wouldn't have been able to level the one I wanted, and probably just would have progressed my WHM, ACN classes, or even started running up a BRD because of some silly notion that one random tank needed to be gated. I'm certainly nothing super special, but if someone who just started under a year ago and who only played BLM and RDM prior can pick up DRK and be passable at it, it's not a problem with the class curve likely, it's a problem with the general playerbase, which is something we see regularly across all roles.

[WhyAmIHere]

Leveling dark knights not using their cooldowns, eh?

...what cooldowns?

[DRKoftheAzure]

Back when I started in Heavensward, I wanted to be DRK but saw that it was an advanced job/class which could get cross-class skills from GLA and MRD, so naturally I needed to learn tanking basics before picking up DRK. However tanking in FF14 now is more boring due to some abilities generating too much aggro that it is impossible to lose it. And role action in its current state is a poor replacement to cross-class.

[Claire_Pendragon]

Lv30 DRK and lower is honestly easier to learn than WAR or PLD imo.
The only exception being having less CDs to work with.

(1st) Unmend/face pull
(2nd) Unleash
(3rd) pop Rampart if its up. (Do u have anticipation yet? i forget)

You're done.

PLD just has renamed versions of unmend and unleash, but generates less threat with flash slightly
WAR runs out of TP w/o flash now, and has to par zerk with overpower, to avoid having to overpower too much, unless ur paired with a SAM or RDM, then ull probably still have to run dry on TP to keep hate, until u finally get ur 3rd hit combo at 30. (Make sure not to pull with tomahawk early levels, since it will only serve to help run u dry in TP.)