My Analysis of BLM's issues and why it is currently the worst DPS class.

[Bernkastelx]

There is a reason people make these give me my dps back. When you pick up brd/nin/drg/rdm/mch you go "Okay I offer party buffs so I can accept I don't do the most dmg". Now lets step in blm shoes "Oh I don't offer anything and those guys are doing close/same to my dmg I guess that is ok???". Then you start to play with the new smn everybody loves, "Huh they fixed a lot of the problems, don't really run out of mana spamming ruin 3/2 ruin 4 procs instant, derpmut still there but its cool doing close to sam dmg and I got a pocket raise just in case." Just my opinions of course anything that advertises selfish dps like this game does is doing it wrong. Overall its about gameplay how well the class feels and comparing it to others and unfortunately even when you do manage the best uptime with blm its still not good enough to warrant playing it.

Edit- 24 caster raid with yoshi https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...yoshi_ps_walk/

Also prog/clear on blm heavens no that is sadistic but for farm sure.

[BlackcatChen]

They are not really off, being that your being "Smoked" is more of player competence and understanding. Your source is more of estimation and like you mentioned not 100% and really gives no actual data just estimations. I'm referring to Trial runs, actual testing. Mine at least were of a set of various communities that have tested. If your raid leader or even yourself were to use ACT you may see a complete different perspective. Your estimated numbers may even lack recommended just to get a new perspective you should try it.

Please do not try to discredit somebody's hard work if you do not even understand how it works, or where its data comes from, that's just incredibly petty. The only "estimation" comes from turning speed/crit buffs into static damage buffs so it doesn't have to go through the entire log (which would be insane on web requests to a certain FFXIV information gathering website). As well as not going through logs line by line to factor in buffs being stacked (they're multiplicative, not additive), that's why it's not 100%. In this fashion, it still favours the ones dealing damage more, not the ones giving the buff. It is all generated from actual data, and you can generate calculations from your own logs with it. Even before I created this website explicitly for the purpose of shedding more light on Personal DPS vs Raid DPS, it was pretty obvious that NIN, DRG, and BRD were contributing insane amounts of raid DPS. There's a reason why those three are in almost every single deltascape savage speed kill known to man. They produce the most damage. And most of those are DRG/NIN/BRD/MCH, for obvious reasons.

One more thing, a call to "player competence and understanding" implies that you personally do have the competence to back that claim up, with solid proof that you're even qualified to say something like that. Saying that no BLM could possibly have great uptime is an insult to all players that put their most into their play. You're saying you haven't even cleared the most simple savage tier this game has had. Please, stop insulting people that way, especially if you do not have the full picture.

I'll reiterate what a lot of people have been saying here regarding this thread's argument:
- Good BLM can optimize most encounters in this game to near full uptime using the current toolset.
- BLM even in prog can safely figure out how to learn encounters (this is including savage and ultimate) while keeping generally good uptime using the current toolset.
- A BLM at 100% uptime (full performance, no place left to optimize and get better at) in the same composition type does ~200PDPS less than SMN. (Look at actual statistics here, they all exist in the usual places)
- A BLM at 100% uptime does a lot less RDPS than DRG, NIN, BRD, MCH, SMN, MNK. Once you factor in raid dps buffs, the picture becomes a lot different how much damage a job is actually contributing. They're one of the weakest jobs in the game right now.

I'll echo earlier statements: BLM mobility is the best it has been, barring 2.5. But even in 2.5, BLM would KILL to have sharpcast and triplecast for Earth Shaker in T13. Good BLM have managed near 100% uptime on Living Liquid Savage, with no spell speed melds available, a 10 second astral fire timer, a 3 second fire 4 cast time, and of course no triplecast or between the lines because 3.0. BLM is hurting for raid DPS contribution right now. That's the main, #1 concern. Quality of Life would be nice, but without proper damage in your party, BLM might as well not exist, they currently have no real purpose in your party.

[Usho]

That last wall of text is exactly why I detest these "damage meters" any other thing that measures people's damage output. Who the hell cares? I could give 2 craps about if you're out dps'ing me. All that is, is a dps d**k measuring contest. I play to have fun, on a class that I love. All you folks who obsess over data, damage output or someone else's damage output makes me cringe.

Every class has a purpose in every party, even BLM. To say that, they have no real purpose in a party shows blunt ignorance and is only base opinion and shouldn't be taken to discourage those who play BLM or want to play BLM. Could BLM be improved? Of course, but I don't think it's extremely necessary. I BLM myself and I don't have issues with my own personal damage. It's one of my strongest jobs.

[Usho]

Wanna improve damage? Get better gear. Eat good food. Use Stat potions. Use good melds on your gear. Boom. That's it. That's how I improve my damage and I don't obsess over it.

In conclusion, to those who are reading this thread and are concerned about if you want to try BLM or disown it because of people's opinions, my advice is if you enjoy BLM, keep playing it.

Don't let damage obeissent whiners detour you from a job that you enjoy. As a BLM, know that, you have a place in every party and that you help contribute to a team's success. If someone tells you your damage isn't good enough for them or their static, then give them a simple "bye" and find a group who will take you. There are groups who will and won't b***h over your damage numbers. Get good gear and melds and eat food and use pots. That's all I need on BLM and I contribute a lot to my static.


Good Game.

/2 Cents

[Slick7]

Wanna improve damage? Get better gear. Eat good food. Use Stat potions. Use good melds on your gear. Boom. That's it. That's how I improve my damage and I don't obsess over it.

Play the class you like is good advice. Not obsessing over numbers in a balance discussion is not.

[Usho]

And you are part of the problem. I rest my case.

[Nobuyoki]

Well, your talk is pretty and so on, but you're telling us that BLM brings something to the group. My question is then : what? Comparing to SMN and RDM, which brings rez/more utility (and more dmg from smn), BLM doesn't bring something really unique apart being the dude that doesn't want to get away from the leylines (and that stays at one pixels from the AoE because he doesn't want to move).

Plus, you're pretty cute when you say "Eat food, git gud, git better stuff", because people that try to argue on this thread already do all of those stuff (I hope for them though ;D). They want BLM to fulfill its niche of "selfish" dps to the end in high end duty (Which is : Omega Savage/Ultimate Coil). They do bring DPS, they can clear (nearly) every content with some work, but that's not the problem here. Sure, if you want to do casual content, or midcore savage clears, play what you find the funnier to play. But people here argue for hardcore groups : the meta comp is pretty set, and BLM is one of the most unwanted DPS here.

Just to add my 2 cents to the discussion (in order to avoid a complete out of subject answer, sorry ._.), I main BLM because I love its immobility. Trying to play around with that on fights like O3S/O4S is really what I find interesting, especially since we're pretty mobile now. And I must agree with BlackCat that when you manage to get the best uptime that you could, BLM should be top 1 or 2 in term of DPS, since it brings nothing else (apart from crossclass thingy).

[HaroldSaxon]

I still think the issue lies partly in fight design as well. Not saying Blm is good as it is, it desperately needs buffs/adjustments, but I feel like fights in SB were designed without any thought to casters.
The boss' rotations not only poorly align with our skill set, they seems to actively break our flow, bosses jumping every time Ley Lines come off cd, mechanics that force movement taking too long to somehow rescue enochian through it, forced movement favors melee who can hit while I on Blm can do nothing, Lb animation locking us in place too long so we will lose stacks and enochian no matter what,...

I recently ran A8S for the fun of it on lv70 and I found it shocking how much better my cds align with a fight, that wasn't designed with this rotation in mind, than with fights actually designed for it.

That has always been an issue with BLM and casters in general. Its just less of a factor now with all of our movement tools.

This is the main problem of all of the "plz gimme my big dick back" or " I don't fit in the meta plz change me" threads ever posted ^^

While I DO get what and why people are upset because they don't """find""" a place or anything in teams and raid, or find the mecanical aspect of a job a pain in the ass in some fights (yes I'm looking at you bloody dark hole under exdeath's cape) I want to ask you.

Did or didn't you clear savage content with your so called "no meta class" ^^

Just because a job can clear eventually doesn't mean its meta or balanced. A meta class can clear content much quicker than a non meta class.

Please do not try to discredit somebody's hard work if you do not even understand how it works, or where its data comes from, that's just incredibly petty. The only "estimation" comes from turning speed/crit buffs into static damage buffs so it doesn't have to go through the entire log (which would be insane on web requests to a certain FFXIV information gathering website). As well as not going through logs line by line to factor in buffs being stacked (they're multiplicative, not additive), that's why it's not 100%. In this fashion, it still favours the ones dealing damage more, not the ones giving the buff. It is all generated from actual data, and you can generate calculations from your own logs with it. Even before I created this website explicitly for the purpose of shedding more light on Personal DPS vs Raid DPS, it was pretty obvious that NIN, DRG, and BRD were contributing insane amounts of raid DPS. There's a reason why those three are in almost every single deltascape savage speed kill known to man. They produce the most damage. And most of those are DRG/NIN/BRD/MCH, for obvious reasons.

One more thing, a call to "player competence and understanding" implies that you personally do have the competence to back that claim up, with solid proof that you're even qualified to say something like that. Saying that no BLM could possibly have great uptime is an insult to all players that put their most into their play. You're saying you haven't even cleared the most simple savage tier this game has had. Please, stop insulting people that way, especially if you do not have the full picture.

I'll reiterate what a lot of people have been saying here regarding this thread's argument:
- Good BLM can optimize most encounters in this game to near full uptime using the current toolset.
- BLM even in prog can safely figure out how to learn encounters (this is including savage and ultimate) while keeping generally good uptime using the current toolset.
- A BLM at 100% uptime (full performance, no place left to optimize and get better at) in the same composition type does ~200PDPS less than SMN. (Look at actual statistics here, they all exist in the usual places)
- A BLM at 100% uptime does a lot less RDPS than DRG, NIN, BRD, MCH, SMN, MNK. Once you factor in raid dps buffs, the picture becomes a lot different how much damage a job is actually contributing. They're one of the weakest jobs in the game right now.

I'll echo earlier statements: BLM mobility is the best it has been, barring 2.5. But even in 2.5, BLM would KILL to have sharpcast and triplecast for Earth Shaker in T13. Good BLM have managed near 100% uptime on Living Liquid Savage, with no spell speed melds available, a 10 second astral fire timer, a 3 second fire 4 cast time, and of course no triplecast or between the lines because 3.0. BLM is hurting for raid DPS contribution right now. That's the main, #1 concern. Quality of Life would be nice, but without proper damage in your party, BLM might as well not exist, they currently have no real purpose in your party.

Nail on the head. Although I could manage to cast clip with EarthShakers in T13 back then!

That last wall of text is exactly why I detest these "damage meters" any other thing that measures people's damage output. Who the hell cares? I could give 2 craps about if you're out dps'ing me. All that is, is a dps d**k measuring contest. I play to have fun, on a class that I love. All you folks who obsess over data, damage output or someone else's damage output makes me cringe.

Every class has a purpose in every party, even BLM. To say that, they have no real purpose in a party shows blunt ignorance and is only base opinion and shouldn't be taken to discourage those who play BLM or want to play BLM. Could BLM be improved? Of course, but I don't think it's extremely necessary. I BLM myself and I don't have issues with my own personal damage. It's one of my strongest jobs.

Your post adds nothing to this discussion other than your personal incorrect anecdotal experiences. But i'll bite - what purpose does BLM bring to a party? Raw damage? SAM and SMN do more. Party DPS? Every other class apart from RDM does more.

Personally, i'd say it makes me cringe that you claim to play BLM and are unaware of the issues of the class. But then again, have you cleared Savage level content? But then again, coming into a balance thread and NOT wanting to talk about statistics

Wanna improve damage? Get better gear. Eat good food. Use Stat potions. Use good melds on your gear. Boom. That's it. That's how I improve my damage and I don't obsess over it.

In conclusion, to those who are reading this thread and are concerned about if you want to try BLM or disown it because of people's opinions, my advice is if you enjoy BLM, keep playing it.

Don't let damage obeissent whiners detour you from a job that you enjoy. As a BLM, know that, you have a place in every party and that you help contribute to a team's success. If someone tells you your damage isn't good enough for them or their static, then give them a simple "bye" and find a group who will take you. There are groups who will and won't b***h over your damage numbers. Get good gear and melds and eat food and use pots. That's all I need on BLM and I contribute a lot to my static.


Good Game.

/2 Cents

Have you even cleared Savage yet? All DPS statistics take into account BiS gear, top end food, stat potions and optimal melds. BLM still is the worst DPS class to bring overall, and the second worse for raid DPS. That is a fact. Its great that you have a lot of fun on it. But it is absolutely unfair that other classes consistently get preferential treatment in this game over Black Mage.

[Remedi]

I would add that SAM has the possibility of bringing some utility to the group albeit limited, however it's still relevant and makes BLM having nothing AND less dps than them totally stupid imho

[Dualgunner]

And you are part of the problem. I rest my case.

No, quite frankly you're the problem coming into a thread discussing balance and complaining about numbers. Its like walking into a bar and complaining about alcohol.