This is why this game should'nt get a parse

[Nedkel]

Highly debatable. People who are jerks will continue to be jerks regardless of a parse. In fact, they already use ACT to bully but just are careful to avoid mentioning numbers.

We just recently had a thread from a player from world of wacraft saying, he appreciate how community is so much less toxic.
Guess why.
Keyword "recount".

[Lilseph]

We just recently had a thread from a player from world of wacraft saying, he appreciate how community is so much less toxic.
Guess why.
Keyword "recount".

Same thing than any poster here. One player isn't a valid representation of the whole community/state of the game. He might have left because of the Recount, but that's his personal reason. I can say, as an ocassional WoW player, that Recount has never been an issue for me. Even after using a jump potion of Legion after years of not playing, people were understanding with my lack of tanking capabilities and provided hints and guides. So, this evens out, right?

And that's only bringing the "parser" jerks. You have many types of jerks around either casual, midcore and hardcore players will be jerks on its own way. Like our SAM last night in O2S, people made a mistake with the push back mechanic and he started spreading poison "DID U GUIS GET CARRIED THRU O4S OR WUT??!" (even though he barely was doing the same DPS than our tanks, so he wasn't a parser jerk). People asked him to chill, he didn't. The error got addressed and the SAM got kicked because of his attitude. Run a dungeon, don't do an unncessary strat with a boss that can easily be cheessed through and have people rage at you for not doing it. Go hunt and pull, you'll be yelled at for "early pulling"; receiving nasty tells that involve your mother and potentially other family members. Queue up for any PvP mode. I don't know, these are a couple of examples.

[Deithwen]

We just recently had a thread from a player from world of wacraft saying, he appreciate how community is so much less toxic.
Guess why.
Keyword "recount".

Indeed, feedback from one player should be able to sum up all Wow player's experience...

I know many wow players who never complained about parsers, does it make it relevant ? no, because those are anecdotes.

[Nedkel]

Indeed, feedback from one player should be able to sum up all Wow player's experience...

I know many wow players who never complained about parsers, does it make it relevant ? no, because those are anecdotes.

And i know many wow players that were complaining about it when it came out.

If someone is curious how it looked like in WoW i propose to read this article from a Wow journalist, explained how the meteric combat log affected the dungeons.
https://www.engadget.com/2010/01/23/...te-dps-meters/

Its not a coincidence that many mmorpgs are just punishing or prohibiting using addons like these.

[Sebazy]

And i know many wow players that were complaining about it when it came out.

If someone is curious how it looked like in WoW i propose to read this article from a Wow journalist, explained how the meteric combat log affected the dungeons.
https://www.engadget.com/2010/01/23/...te-dps-meters/

Its not a coincidence that many mmorpgs are just punishing or prohibiting using addons like these.

Uhm, have you actually read the article? Like properly?

It's hardly a scathing critique of meters and parsing etc.

Now, about 2,000 words in, I have come to a realization. I don't actually hate DPS meters. I've focused largely upon their failings in the environment of the new random dungeon finder. In a traditional raiding environment, though, they're must-have tools. You have an organized group, taking on challenging content, and it's vital to know if somebody can't pull their weight in an extended combat encounter. It's important to know if you have enough DPS to swap one out for an additional healer or off-tank, or if your DPS is lacking and you need to replace members, or ask somebody to change specs. No, I guess I don't hate damage meters.

I hate the people who misuse them.

So the next time you glance over and realize that LolpallyXxX is only throwing down 1k DPS in heroic Nexus, and you're suddenly struck by the urge to link his meager numbers to the rest of the group, stop. Take a breath. Look around. Are the mobs dying? Is the run going smoothly? Are you in heroic freaking Nexus? If you're nodding your head to those questions, you need to reconsider your motivation.

Isn't that what most of the pro parse crowd are saying as well? =s

[Nedkel]

Uhm, have you actually read the article? Like properly?

It's hardly a scathing critique of meters and parsing etc.

Isn't that what most of the pro parse crowd are saying as well? =s

Its only a disclaimer for him, so he will not be tomato thrown by the wow community. Read the article further on his analysis.

Should i really cite the parts of article...

They breed an unnecessary sense of intra-group competition.

So let's look at the reasons a person might feel obligated to link the damage meter in party chat:
They were asked to do so by someone who doesn't have Recount installed, but would like to know how they are doing. In this case, I usually just whisper the numbers to that specific individual.
They were topping the chart, and wanted everyone to know it.
They want to point out someone's perceived sub-par performance to the group.
They are the tank and want to shame the DPS by notifying them that the tank is outperforming them.
They suffer from muscle spasms, and accidentally clicked the wrong button.
Of those five reasons, one is justifiable, one is improbable, and the other three mean you are a prick.

The first time somebody links Recount in chat, the group dynamic instantly changes. Suddenly it's on. The game condenses down to a single gnawing imperative: I must lead that meter. Whoever is last on the list instantly feels terrible. They may not have anywhere near the gear they need to outperform the other two DPS members of the party, but they feel bad about it just the same, because if you linked, you clearly want them to know how badly they're doing. The person topping the group feels good about themselves, but might also begin to resent the underperforming members of the group, feeling that they aren't pulling their weight. The group atmosphere goes, in one fell swoop, from cooperative to toxic.

What was the point of linking it? The answer, of course, is my fourth reason for hating damage meters:

[HyoMinPark]

Its only a disclaimer for him, so he will not be tomato thrown by the wow community. Read the article further on his analysis.

Should i really cite the parts of article...

To be frank, if the article’s author says “I hate damage meters”, then 2,000 words later says “I don’t hate them”, and then says, later on, “I hate damage meters” again, that just shows indecisiveness and incoherence on their part, and a lot of inconsistency in their argument. It doesn’t really serve as a solid argument for or against parsers, anecdotalness of the entire article aside.

Edit: Now that I’m free to further comment, here is, what I feel, the main argument of the entire article:

Now, before you tune out completely and start sharpening the pitchforks, let me clarify. I understand and appreciate the positive uses for damage meters. I have Recount installed on all my characters and use it liberally. Here are the things damage meters are good for:

Monitoring your own DPS.
Using the meter to help you when tweaking specs, gear setups, or testing spell rotations.
In raids.

Here are things damage meters should not be used for:

Linking in party chat during a random PUG, without being asked to do so.
Determining who's a good DPS and who isn't.
Justifying a vote-kick.

I almost feel like I could distill this entire column down into one sentence: don't be a douche.

This argument is what several of the “pro-parser” posters on the forum argue: there is nothing wrong with parsers if they are used responsibly, and that it is wrong for people to blatantly misuse and abuse them. This article, in its entirety, is not “anti-parser”; it is “anti parser abuse”. The author is basically saying what everyone else has been saying: it’s fine if you use parsers, but don’t be a tool about it. Harassment is still unacceptable. Yes, they point out the downsides of using them, but look at Sebazy’s quote—they don’t actually dislike the parser itself, but the misuse of it. There is a difference.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Its only a disclaimer for him, so he will not be tomato thrown by the wow community. Read the article further on his analysis.

Should i really cite the parts of article...

This is equal parts selective reading as it is cherry picking. You've quoted only the portions which agree with your already bias opinion yet taken them out of context. The author closes by acknowledging the value of damage meters, admits to using one and conclusions by basically saying, "I hate people who misuse them."

Try actually reading the fully article next time and not just quote parts you like.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

We just recently had a thread from a player from world of wacraft saying, he appreciate how community is so much less toxic.
Guess why.
Keyword "recount".

Its not a coincidence that many mmorpgs are just punishing or prohibiting using addons like these.

Anecdotal evidence is anecdotal.

Shall I rebuke your opinion with, ironically, a separate article from the same website? And would you look at that. The very first recommendation they make is to "not fear the damage meter." It's almost like opinion pieces aren't a good source of evidence.

Actually, they don't. FFXIV is among the very few MMOs that doesn't relay information to the player whatsoever in regards to numbers, or allow third party access. This extends to even basic things like exact Crit percentage increases. Blade and Soul tells you precisely the impact it will have on your damage whereas FFXIV hides it behind a nebulous number we have to use ACT to decipher.