This is why this game should'nt get a parse

[Dualgunner]

His examples were all jobs.

First example is probably the most relevant. National sports teams are professional but in the end they are still playing a game.

[jameseoakes]

First example is probably the most relevant. National sports teams are professional but in the end they are still playing a game.

Which makes it a job for them

[HyoMinPark]

Which makes it a job for them

Not if they don’t view it as one, though. Some people actually don’t view their job as a “job” if they enjoy it that much.

Regardless, the poster that was quoted has been discussing this game in the majority of his other posts in this thread. His examples may not be the best, but the underlying point is still that playing this game well, or knowing how to play your main job well/optimizing it, does not equate to treating the game like a job. Some people enjoy optimization and do not see it as them making their gaming experience into a job.

[Cakekizyy]

Not if they don’t view it as one, though. Some people actually don’t view their job as a “job” if they enjoy it that much.

Regardless, the poster that was quoted has been discussing this game in the majority of his other posts in this thread. His examples may not be the best, but the underlying point is still that playing this game well, or knowing how to play your main job well/optimizing it, does not equate to treating the game like a job. Some people enjoy optimization and do not see it as them making their gaming experience into a job.

Doesn't matter how they view it, if they get paid it's a job.

[Dualgunner]

Doesn't matter how they view it, if they get paid it's a job.

FFXIV, then, became a job for Team 5150 who were sponsored during world first prog on Ultimate.

[jameseoakes]

FFXIV, then, became a job for Team 5150 who were sponsored during world first prog on Ultimate.

Yes it did

[HyoMinPark]

Yes it did

The vast majority of other players, however, do not get paid to play the game. Therefore, it is not a job for them, regardless of how they play, if we want to go by this definition of “if you’re getting paid, then it’s a job” (which, unpaid internships would like a word with people here, but this is all beside the point now).

I’m just getting really tired of people insinuating that people who play their job well, or who enjoy optimization and pushing themselves to get better in the game, are treating the game like a job. No one is forcing 95th percentile play on the “causal playerbase”; they are asking for them to pull their weight when they join in on harder content that requires working with other people to clear. And to, you know, maybe NOT fabricate stories about parser abuse when it clearly did not happen to them.

[KaldeaSahaline]

Just adding my 2 cents.
Never cared for parses or people that use it, was in the mindset of: "whatever".But after reading this thread yesterday I went and set up act to see whats the deal, and god damnit that shit is addictive lol, not only did i spend a good 1-2 hrs just hitting a dummy and parsing to see how high i could get each time (never did spend time on a dummy before) but now im parsing everything, from high level content to low, and by the gods I think i almost broke my fingers yesterday trying everytime to be on the top of those dps bars on every dungeon i did lol, from kugane castle to even tam tara... (yeah I got so addicted to it that i even parsed tam tara >.>)

So really, if even I, a filthy lazy casual with not much time to play started to really try my best after setting up act, I believe every player should get it to evaluate themselves (and from what i saw in expert roulette, a lot of players should >.>)

This post is exactly why I am so passionate about the topic. Thank you very much for sharing.

Making your own party only side steps the problem without addressing it. This should absolutely not be a norm. Being a competent player, yes, but holding using a metric that is not officially supported by the game using a program that is in violation to the Terms of Service should not be looked the other way. This is the exact thing people say mention when they say only a "minority of people abuse parsers" while others say they want it for self improvement.

The fact that more PFs are popping up with these conditions is proving contrary to these statements.

A single solitary anecdotal experience doesn't qualify as definitive enough to make such a sweeping generalization. Do you have any hard quantifiable data that supports your statement? Like how about percentage of PF groups requiring said measures, split by datacenter/time, etc. What assumptions did you settle on in order to arrive at your conclusion?

There is a difference between underperforming and people's perception of underperforming.

Here's an example: What do you feel about someone doing 4,300 DPS in v4s?

This is exactly why logs are important. You giving a random number gives absolutely no context. Without knowing the exact situation I cannot state how I would feel about someone doing 4,300 DPS in O4S. If you un-hide your logs I could give a little more insight into your question.

Also, you're all twisting what I am saying using hypothetical. I never once said we should accept "underperforming" players, but having unreasonable standards to people that can legitimately clear the fight (IE: not carried) is a problem.

In your opinion what percentile is the cutoff for not being carried. What factors went into your decision?

Yes and before I made the post, I saw my fifth party this week requesting people with "orange DPS only" - which filled after my post and I saw no reason to take a screenshot (if I did, I'd be sending it to SE, not the forums). So, of course, you looking after my post would mean they are not there. It already filled.

I hate to do this, but let's run the scenario:

1) Player comes to forums to complain about FFlogs.
2) Player has decidedly hidden their logs.
3) Player threatens to report people who have done nothing wrong.

I'd bet with near 100% certainty that it isn't the community that is the issue here, but I'm just making an educated guess.