This is why this game should'nt get a parse

[Tridus]

Early on in one of these threads I posted about an experience in Keeper of the Lake where we ended up abandoning because the DPS wasn't up to par and the healer couldn't keep us up indefinitely, and I was one of the DPS. Happened to get it again last night while on the same job.

Second time around went fine. The interesting thing is that the first time I thought my DPS was okay (since I was half of the total group DPS), until I saw my number the second time had nearly *doubled*. Turned out I was also part of the problem in the first group. It looked fine compared to people in the group but I was actually making some serious BRD mistakes that I've been able to work on since then and it really showed in the return visit. I'm not even close to a top tier player, but that's a huge gain and it helps make any run I'm in go more smoothly, so I'm really happy.

That's where the value in a comparative analysis comes in vs a personal only parser, in that it provides some context to figure out what X means. Without that, you're running half-blind because you have a number but no context and no way to do a proper analysis with it.

That said, SE probably won't add one because they're in the perfect spot right now. The tool exists if you want access to it (albeit it you need assistance if you play on PS4). SE has rules to ban people who cause problems with it, and otherwise they can ignore it. It costs them nothing in development budget. With how much stuff they want to do and how often budget is an issue, is it worth taking someone off stuff like glamour system improvements to implement what can already be provided if you google how to do it? Let alone the ongoing testing and maintenance costs bringing it into the game would require.

For them, the status quo works.

[KaldeaSahaline]

However, I have seen it before. The addition of an official parser would not suddenly change the nice community we still have overall to an absolute toxic nightmare, but it would change over time. First we would begin to see people complaining in these very same forums because they were dismissed from a party for no apparent reason. Then we would see posts debating if low dps is a valid reason to dismiss someone in duty finder.

These already exist. We're quite literally posting in one of them right now.

You also do not have any real data that says it would become more toxic (if you do, please cite it, not anecdotes real quantifiable data). It could just as easily become less toxic, because players want to not be excluded thus they attempt to get better. Neither of us have any ACTUAL data to back up our claims, so let's not speculate shall we?

Then we would begin to see people ignoring mechanics only to get higher dps. Then we would begin to see people ninja-pulling bosses before the countdown is over only to mess everybody else's opener and get a lead in the dps meters.

This is a common myth that is perpetuated by unskilled players. Look at the best players, ignoring mechanics is not how they achieve top DPS. They do it by managing uptime in intelligent ways but always respecting mechanics. Ignoring mechanics gets you damage down stacks, one shot, or wipes the party thus killing any hopes of doing DPS.

Also, if you had done any log review/parsing yourself you'd know that that getting the jump on a countdown actually reduces your DPS. Good openers are good because they take into account ENTIRE party openers and buff timings, and disrupting that hurts you, not helps you.

Easily. If SE makes parsers official then they are no longer against TOS and grounds to ban someone. It removes a very powerful deterrent to people bringing out parsers to harass others. It makes my game worse by having to put up with those people.

This is inaccurate and a common mistakenly made point. Just because a parser is official doesn't mean that they're CONDONING harassment. These two events are mutually exclusive. Harassment would still be punished just as it is now.

Defining harassment would be the challenge, not policing/punishing it.

Which of the below are harassment in your opinion?:

"Alien Gamer your numbers are low."
"We need more DPS, 2 people are doing sub 2k."
"Stop being AFK please, we need your help to clear."
"Please try to DPS healer, there's no outgoing damage."
"**** you, you ******* ****. Abort yourself."

At first I had almost no logs/grey logs and good thing I had friends to play with. Imagine if I had to PF content to learn how to farm those fights? (Note: Learn how to properly optimize your job, the boss rotations and stuff, not learning the fight).

So, I've learned O1s and O2s good enough to get purple logs because of those friend guild runs. What would happen if I never had the chance to do that?

Still working to get purples on O3s and O4s tho.

Not every group actually checks logs. I mean I know mine doesn't when we pug someone. Be able to talk, listen and be versatile and your percentile doesn't matter. As soon as you compromise on those human qualities, people expect better performance.

Don't be afraid to put your reputation on the line. I pugged my first O3S kill after about 10 hours over the course of 2 weeks of learning. I had never seen enrage, but had seen like 25%, but knew the fight was just the same at that point.

I said to the PF leader, hey, I know the fight front to back, can MT or OT, I haven't cleared yet, but I put up good numbers and if I make a single mistake, I'll remove myself and you can blacklist me for wasting peoples time.

They invited me and we one shot it.

If you're not comfortable enough to put it all out there, you could use more practice on the fight then. Sidenote - I'm on behemoth as well, if you need a co-tank to help with anything let me know just shoot me a friend request.

[SaitoHikari]

I have seen all of this in other games, and I don't want to see it here. So I don't want any official parser. If you want to parse you can, there are ways, but keep it for yourself. SE is going to give us a better tool regardless, you will be able to record the whole run and see exactly what everybody are doing. For those who say they need a parser to be able to improve the overall performance of their static, there you go, the best tool ever made for that purpose, much better than a parser.

This is actually pretty good point, from someone that openly parses as well. They just need to remove the restriction on requiring everyone in the party to consent to the recording. There's no reason one person should be able to block that for nothing other than very selfish reasons, when other people in the party may need it to actually learn. Otherwise, I don't see the feature actually being used outside of statics.

[HyoMinPark]

SE is going to give us a better tool regardless, you will be able to record the whole run and see exactly what everybody are doing. For those who say they need a parser to be able to improve the overall performance of their static, there you go, the best tool ever made for that purpose, much better than a parser.

I want to point out the issues with this Replay feature though. Not only do you need the consent of every player in the party, but you can only view the recordings inside of an Inn room, and you can only have 3 at any given time, according to the information provided during the Live Letter.

There’s a huge flaw in a feature that a single person can effectively render useless. Aside from the fact that you could not view it on the fly; you would need to leave the duty, return to an Inn room, and then watch it there, provided you have a free spot for a recording. With much better recording services out there (Twitch or other third-party programs/streaming sites), I personally consider this feature incredibly useless, and it in no way gives you the same amount of information a parse or log would.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

SE is going to give us a better tool regardless, you will be able to record the whole run and see exactly what everybody are doing. For those who say they need a parser to be able to improve the overall performance of their static, there you go, the best tool ever made for that purpose, much better than a parser.

Replay provides no information regarding damage output, thus it's entirely worthless when compared to parsers. With FFlogs, I can accurately pinpoint nearly every single moment throughout an encounter; right down to the overheal, buff usage, rotation and even replay the fight itself. What SE's offering is a dumbed down Youtube equivalent without battle logs. And as Hyomin mentioned, it can only be viewed in the inn whereas parsers are real time. Basically, Replay will, unfortunately, be DoA, I feel.

[Sebazy]

Is this actually confirmed that SE will put in a recording feature? Seem's wasteful given both PC and PS4 users can do this already courtesy of Twitch etc.

Also don't forget that video recordings are very different beasts to logs. Got a key mechanic wiping your group repeatedly? A video replay makes mistakes and failures much more immediately apparent and easier to spot than a log. Undergeared, hitting enrage and need to start going down optimisation rabbit hole? A video replay isn't nearly as useful here, whereas a log's timeline makes things much more obvious in this regard.

And no, that doesn't mean figuring out who's a few % behind the rest and flaming them, I'm referring to things such as dot optimisation and better cooldown alignment. Stuff that is often nigh impossible to accurately track on a PoV replay.

If the client tracked timestamps more precisely whilst also allowing dots to be separated and routed to the chat log, things would be somewhat different.

[HyoMinPark]

Is this actually confirmed that SE will put in a recording feature? Seem's wasteful given both PC and PS4 users can do this already courtesy of Twitch etc.

Yes, it’s called the Duty Recorder function. You can record and save up to three recordings, but only in everyone in the party consents, and it disables battle logs so you can’t actively look at outgoing damage from players. Like I mentioned before, I’m personally of the opinion that it’s a waste because there are already third-party streaming and recording sites/features that aren’t so incredibly limited. You can also only view the recordings in an Inn Room, so they can’t be used real-time or after a wipe for immediate analysis.

[Sebazy]

Yes, it’s called the Duty Recorder function. You can record and save up to three recordings, but only in everyone in the party consents, and it disables battle logs so you can’t actively look at outgoing damage from players.

Urp

That's somewhat useless as an analysis tool with the battle log disabled. That honestly strikes me as more of a /gpose style tool than anything practical for raiders frankly. Mind you, I imagine it'll make for some fantastic screenshots <3

[SaitoHikari]

Yes, it’s called the Duty Recorder function. You can record and save up to three recordings, but only in everyone in the party consents, and it disables battle logs so you can’t actively look at outgoing damage from players. Like I mentioned before, I’m personally of the opinion that it’s a waste because there are already third-party streaming and recording sites/features that aren’t so incredibly limited. You can also only view the recordings in an Inn Room, so they can’t be used real-time or after a wipe for immediate analysis.

Welp, I didn't know about the disabling battle logs part.

Yup, definite dead on arrival then.

[Dualgunner]

Yes, it’s called the Duty Recorder function. You can record and save up to three recordings, but only in everyone in the party consents, and it disables battle logs so you can’t actively look at outgoing damage from players. Like I mentioned before, I’m personally of the opinion that it’s a waste because there are already third-party streaming and recording sites/features that aren’t so incredibly limited. You can also only view the recordings in an Inn Room, so they can’t be used real-time or after a wipe for immediate analysis.

Wait, it disables battle logs? So if everyone consents to the recording, does that mean parsers wouldn't pick anything up?

The thing that excites me the most about the replay would be the ability to pause and look at specific events through other player's perspectives: what comes to mind is a simple "Watch how I handle GCO, and emulate it" but it being limited like this is going to kill a lot of that for me. >.<