SE: if it aint broke, dont fix it (War)

[Aana]

The war group attacks drks and its not fair!

The drk group attacks wars and its not fair!

And this is the general problem with the tank forums. The UP tank of the month makes sweeping generalizations about the OP tank of the month players. The OP tank of the month makes sweeping generalizations about the UP tank of the month players.

You cant on the one hand talk about War players as an arrogant/entitled group of players while in the same breath playing the unfairly generalized victim card when a War claimes Drks players are a whiney group that would rather hold other jobs hostage until they get buffs.

Each group is just doing the same thing to the other making wildly baseless claims about the motivations and personalities of an entire group of players that chose different jobs to main.

Every QOL/Request/Buff thread about war and pld, drks come clamoring out how they need to get to the back of the line and have 'no right' to ask for anything which is petty and absurd.

Every Drk QOL/Request/Buff thread has throngs saying its not as bad as you think, get over it, git gud, etc.

Wars aren't all a buncha mindless Xeno zombies. Drks aren't a buncha edgy crybabies playing a braindead job.

Those are in no way reflections of the hundreds of thousands of players that tank in this game. Forums are a vocal minority. Most people are just logging in and happily playing their jobs every day. Beating content. Most have never heard of Xeno or can name the job comp of world 1st groups. Stop attributing some made up BS to an entire playerbase because it suits you (OP of the month or UP of the month) as the 'true' victim.

Fighting over whos the bigger community victim doesn't make Drk any better or war any worse. The playerbase racing to the bottom of which group is shit on by the other groups more doesn't help anyone.

[Tegernako]

snip

Actually I said nothing, or at least did not mean to imply anything of that sort.

Anyone who does what I said, to any job, is wrong in my eyes. There have no doubt been times when looking back I'd tell myself that I was in the wrong as well.

I'm calling out individuals not jobs. There's a difference.

Far as I can remember, there has never been a time where I have blatantly said all PLD players or all DRK players, I have always tried to say "some" or specifically focus on one person.

I legit have no issue with DRK players feel snubbed...because I'm one of those players who feels snubbed. Yes I want WAR to be as best it can but I also want DRK to be the best it can. I want all jobs to be as good as they can so that everyone can enjoy themselves or at the very least feel useful. (That doesn't mean I think perfect balance is attainable)

I don't think WAR players are the victim of a vast conspiracy I just think certain people here are utter hypocrites. Like I often have serious disagreements with what you say, like this thread for instance, but the thought of you hating warriors never crossed my mind. That's the difference between people like you and others, which is why, no matter how much I disagree with you, I respond to you differently then I do with people like the other mentioned person you quoted. Because I don't think you're a hypocrite or a hater. I just think you're wrong on a lot of things.

(And you know, I'm probably very wrong on a lot of things. I would never say for instance, that I know more about tanks then you do. My disagreements tend to stem more from how I feel about something, rather then math and statistics and stuff which a lot of your posts have)

That being said, not going to disagree with the other parts of your post. That is exactly what happens and that is exactly what everyone claims every time.

Its all good, as you can see the drk threads have slowed down alot. We've either given up or succumbed to a lesser form of stockholm syndrome to a class we like.

You all enjoy your "usability changes", I'll just keep clipping gcds.

And what if you play WAR and DRK? I can't hope for both?

[Wintersandman]

Snip.

I have to say I love your post. All of it.

[Lyth]

...

It's not about fairness. It's not even about buffs and job balance.

It's silly for someone to complain about hostility directed towards WAR players when they've just made a post dismissing the other two tanks as being "faceroll easy" mere minutes before. This is just common sense.

I don't think this was done out of genuine maliciousness, though. Just a lack of knowledge. Dunning-Kruger effect and all that.

My post was just information. The frustration with terms like "superior design" and "braindead easy" is not new. Nor do you have to search particularly hard either here or on reddit to find them.

I think that players who don't want this sort of a reputation to stick naturally distance themselves from this sort of behaviour. If you feel that it's just the "vocal minority", then don't contribute to it.

[Aana]

It's not about fairness. It's not even about buffs and job balance.

It's silly for someone to complain about hostility directed towards WAR players when they've just made a post dismissing the other two tanks as being "faceroll easy" mere minutes before. This is just common sense.

I don't think this was done out of genuine maliciousness, though. Just a lack of knowledge. Dunning-Kruger effect and all that.

My post was just information. The frustration with terms like "superior design" and "braindead easy" is not new. Nor do you have to search particularly hard either here or on reddit to find them.

I think that players who don't want this sort of a reputation to stick naturally distance themselves from this sort of behaviour. If you feel that it's just the "vocal minority", then don't contribute to it.

And in 3.x pld was the 'braindead easy and UP' class that was weak and you see the same regurgitated junk as you do about 'braindead ez UP Drk' now. In 2.0 Pld was "Braindead EZ and OP" and war was the 'skillful UP' job. 2.1 it was the 'skillfull OP' job. Or any of the variations in between.

It doesn't matter which job is (temporarily) on the top or bottom. Its the same forum biting at itself. Either you play the UP class of the month and are the true victim as everyone holds you down (bonus points if you also claim to be the hardest to play), or youre the OP job and the salty UP job jumps down your throat every time you say anything besides 'nerf me plz'.

In reality, most people who tank:
A: Play multiple tanks so the broad strokes of 'Wars vs Drks vs Plds' is already shoddy
B: Don't read this forum.
C: Don't even know what the meta is or whats 'OP'. I cant count how many times a new face posts here, asks in town, or asks me personally 'which tank should I play' because they don't know jack about any of it. If they read a single thread on the front page theres a 90% chance they already know drk is the 'worst' tank. Yet most people don't 'know' that.

Hell, one of my own raid members Ive been playing with on voip for nearly a decade together since FFXI, beaten everything from Twin to NeoEx, stays on top of patches and updates asked me 'which tank is good now?' just Monday night as they are considering tanking in 4.2 with my war. They were planning on drk because they thought it was better than pld. These aren't newbies that started yesterday. My group makes fun of me when I occasionally babble about nuanced tank stuff. They give no Fs.

The average player gives no Fs about the meta, or this forum, or that drk is 5% lower DPS than pld. 'War players all do this' Drks players all do that etc is utterly silly. Its a forum bubble for the few hundred regular posters that care enough to log in here and post crap. Like you, like me. We are the 1%. Drawing conclusions from the tank forums about the general playerbase of a job is just not an accurate assessment.