Tanks not holding aggro in dungeons? The new norm?

[HyoMinPark]

Er, I'm pretty sure MNK does indeed have one emnity related ability.

EDIT: Correction, they can take 'diversion' - cross-class.

Diversion is an enmity queller; it won't dump aggro. And that's the only option both MNK and SAM have when most other DPS jobs have more than one option--BRD/MCH have Refresh/Tactician, SMN/BLM/RDM have Diversion/Lucid Dreaming, NIN has Diversion plus Shadewalker to give their aggro to the tank, DRG have Diversion/Elusive Jump every 30 seconds to dump aggro. So without a few aggro combos rotated in, SAM/MNK can easily creep up and rip from an unsuspecting tank even while popping Diversion.

Honestly, Invigorate should also function as an aggro dump in addition to TP restoration. I hope this is added in 4.2.

[RopeDrink]

I didn't say it could dump aggro - I simply said one emnity related ability (non-inherent). Just spoke out of muscle memory seeing as even my L61 MNK has been stealing aggro from tanks while using above mentioned ability. May as well have tanked the dungeon myself, but then again she's in shire gear - I suspect these late levellers didn't get that luxury. Either that or they just didn't know how to aggro appropriately (though I will politely assume it was on my end, everybody wins).

[Kabooa]

I didn't say it could dump aggro - I simply said one emnity related ability (non-inherent). Just spoke out of muscle memory seeing as even my L61 MNK has been stealing aggro from tanks while using above mentioned ability. May as well have tanked the dungeon myself, but then again she's in shire gear - I suspect these late levellers didn't get that luxury. Either that or they just didn't know how to aggro appropriately (though I will politely assume it was on my end, everybody wins).

It takes extreme gear disparity to lose threat. Like almost 60 full ilvls of gear. Threat modifiers in this game are insane.

[Lunali]

It takes extreme gear disparity to lose threat. Like almost 60 full ilvls of gear. Threat modifiers in this game are insane.

To drive that point home, my lvl 60 drk can typically hold hate against lvl 70 dps in unsynced trials, though it does require me to actually be in tank stance.

In normal situations, if a tank loses hate, (as opposed to not having it to begin with) it isn't because they couldn't hold hate but because they didn't want to (to passive aggessively teach the dps a lesson) or they were focused on something else, usually doing damage.

[Galgarion]

I only lose threat if I don't want it. Like when dealing with pushy pugs who think they should do my pulls for me.

[Kohdo]

Not the new norm by any means, although I've had a few pretty poor tanks lately that do nothing to re-gain aggro if they lose it.

On an unrelated rant, over the past month or so levelling PLD (I main RDM) I've noticed a lot of shit-poor DPS can't seem to grasp the concept of waiting until the tank has actually finished pulling before spamming AOEs. They of course draw aggro and then run around the instance like a retarded chicken while I'm expected to chase them and pull the mobs back or something. The kind of people that make it impossible to do big pulls and then complain when you don't do big pulls.

If you're intentionally being difficult to work with, wanting the tank to pull lots of mobs but deliberately drawing aggro because you've somehow misunderstood your role in the party, you can tank it. Looking at you, fellow RDMs.

[DRKoftheAzure]

Here is my opinion as a tank and DRK main, when big pulls happen I need to keep both Darkside AND Grit active so that means no mana refresh status EVER, and since it virtually impossible for DRK to run out of TP by making their physical AoE attack cost blood gauge instead of TP for some reason which just so happens to restore MP I constantly have to spam Unleash to hold aggro and kill things 1 at a time(maybe the biggest argument that people want DRK to get buffed aside from better mitigation and better DPS because speed runs are a thing but if they happen to make Souleater apply a powerful Bloodbath effect that also increases damage dealt and reduces damage taken it's a step in the right direction) and for me it's safer to do small pulls unless healer asks me to do big pulls and since I have done some runs of Drowned City as NIN where DRK did a lot of big pulls that I couldn't handle and healer kept them alive, so they must have been gear capped...

[Eliroth-Kaminari]

Big pulls whit DRK is only positive thing left whit that class.
Because raid sene DRK is so out of meta its sad.

Reasons why tank could not hold aggro.
Mostly due fact he was bad but there are few things that can screw tank over.

Example Casting DOT heal on tank mid pull when they get stack of mobs together can make mess of things.
DPS class focusing 1 mobs in stack off mobs in mid pull pulling that on himself whilde tank is moving forward to grab full stack.

if theres senarios happen it will be mess because usualy whit ppl who get aggro run awey (awey from tank) and then its benny hill time where tank chace mob that is chaceing dps.
at that point eather tank dies or healer pull off aggro because tank could not continiue normal aoe rotation on full stack.

but 80% time its just bad tank who dont know what tank-stance stand for because ppl in raid dont use tankstance so why would i use it in normal dungeon.

[Aomine1992]

I think a bad run or two doesn’t make all tanks bad lol or this a “norm”

In leveling content you may receive a new tank or a bad one every once in a while but it’s not as often as non dps healers and single targeting dps doesn’t make it a norm it’s just a random occurrence move on and maybe tank some yourself

Also give them some constructive criticism instead of running to the forums, yes they may tell you to F***** off but I bet you either they leave, get kicked or at least attempt to do better

[TabrisOmbrelame]

I'm playing DRK as main class and when I pull I make an abyssal drain in the pack and then 2-3 unleash... I saw you coming, why unleash instead of Abyssal drain? Before all, consider this opening is only on little pack of 2 or 3 add that hit like hell (like in the Doma castle). I can't explain why, but it seems that Unleash generate way much more enmity than abyssal drain and cost less, after that I go to single target Dps for killing add quickly so I got a better sustain in some unpredictable case.

Of course, if the pack of mobs is clearly high, abyssal drain should be spam 120 potency x the amount of trash, even a dark arts with somewhere for huge healing.

But to return to the subject, I think some tanks forget what role they got, keeping the aggro on them. And just like someone say, Flash = no damage = bad, or at least it's the way they think.

For me a good tank is the tank who don't let a single monster go on his allies