It's past time, Yoshi-P...

[Enla]

Having healers spend the majority of their time healing in group content doesn't mean eliminating dps spells. Healer jobs need to be able to solo out in the open world, too, after all.

And yet Holy has still received numerous nerfs and solo DPS for healers at the beginning of this patch cycle was a nightmare. Every healer main I'm acquainted with had a nightmare of a time soloing through SB compared to HW due to the the developers trying to focus on making healers /heal/ more by nerfing Cleric Stance and many of our kits. Which, as of this current part of the cycle has mostly been undone and with good reason with the exception of Cleric's. The issue here is that these developers don't know how to make both sides viable and tend to take a ratchet to the perceived problem rather than a screw. So forgive me if I honestly can very easily see them blundering in just a bad a way if they tried to forcibly shift the meta yet again.

[HoodRat]

It didn't always. Things were different when it was just ARR. SE has slowly made healing and tanking less necessary. They can continue it or if they really don't intend for the game to be like this, they can make adjustments.

The only difference between ARR and now is that in ARR tanks would sometimes go back into tank stance, whereas now you can just turn it off and forget it exists.

[Sylvina]

It makes tanking and healing a lot less boring.

I agree with this, but I also agree that nobody should be harrassing a tank who's not doing dps levels of dps, or using TANK stance for his job. When tank stance becomes useless for tanking, we have a huge problem.

[Kaethra]

It didn't always. Things were different when it was just ARR. SE has slowly made healing and tanking less necessary. They can continue it or if they really don't intend for the game to be like this, they can make adjustments.

ARR required twice as many Damage Dealing classes as healers and tanks across all of its content that imposed restrictions.

That didn't give away the fact that they placed damage a bit higher? If you ask me, I think non-premade 4 mans should be converted to 8 mans so the DPS have lower queues. 1 tank, 1 healer, and 6 dps. That alone will cut DPS queue times by 50-75%.

[AxlStream]

ARR required twice as many Damage Dealing classes as healers and tanks across all of its content that imposed restrictions.

That didn't give away the fact that they placed damage a bit higher? If you ask me, I think non-premade 4 mans should be converted to 8 mans so the DPS have lower queues. 1 tank, 1 healer, and 6 dps. That alone will cut DPS queue times by 50-75%.

So they'll have to scale up monsters health and instances will take longer as you'll have triple the chances of getting disappointing DPS players? No thanks...

[Tridus]

Just to make it clear: nobody is arguing about how new players don't play optimally.
What is argued revolves around experienced players who made the deliberate choice not to play how the game was designed, even after having the full knowledge of what should and shouldn't be done. It's also about these players not caring about trying to have a balanced team effort no matter what, simply because of their beliefs. We are talking about selfish individuals who make their own comfort as their number one priority, often at the expense of others.

I'm aware. We've been through 100+ pages of this on the healer forum already.

And since you said "this is entirely true, and it's the root of a lot of this" to someone who thinks that the way FFXIV healers are desined is a "flaw", I am obligated to say it again: no, it's not a flaw. The flaw is inside these people's brain, who refuse to think that a game's take on that aspect might be different than the very few other games they have played. They are simply inept to adapt, and that's the problem. Not the game.

Ah, I was replying to the part about it being different in other MMOs specifically, not that it's a flaw. Sorry the confusion.

[Kaethra]

So they'll have to scale up monsters health and instances will take longer as you'll have triple the chances of getting disappointing DPS players? No thanks...

Premades are looking better and better aren't they?

Like I said in a few threads. If you're a tank, just announce you're looking for DPS to queue with. You'll get dozens of replies and they'll do far more damage than getting paired with one who's been in the queue for 45min.

[AxlStream]

Premades are looking better and better aren't they?

Like I said in a few threads. If you're a tank, just announce you're looking for DPS to queue with. You'll get dozens of replies and they'll do far more damage than getting paired with one who's been in the queue for 45min.

Oh believe me, I already do. Doesn't filter out the bad players. Just those not smart enough to look at PF every once in a while.

[Shurrikhan]

Premades are looking better and better aren't they?

Like I said in a few threads. If you're a tank, just announce you're looking for DPS to queue with. You'll get dozens of replies and they'll do far more damage than getting paired with one who's been in the queue for 45min.

Unless I specify speedruns, I tend to get average or below average players in this way. It seems as if PF-only players are often overestimated as being "above" DF, when in fact many of them lack the basic competence to queue on their own for anything serious without soon being kicked, and simply latch onto anti-random sentiments as the cause for their personal shortcomings. Unless the PF specifies, expect that you're also drawing from crowds quite possibly beneath a DF average. The only real restriction you're placing otherwise is whether or not the person searched for a criteria matching your party recruitment while it was open.

[Sylvina]

ARR required twice as many Damage Dealing classes as healers and tanks across all of its content that imposed restrictions.

That didn't give away the fact that they placed damage a bit higher? If you ask me, I think non-premade 4 mans should be converted to 8 mans so the DPS have lower queues. 1 tank, 1 healer, and 6 dps. That alone will cut DPS queue times by 50-75%.

No thanks. smaller teams were a major draw for me for this game, I don't need more 8 man dungeons.