Tank dps harrasment

[MoroMurasaki]

same thing.

not only that, that only really works for the knights and yet, people still don't know how defiance works (and only spells work... skilled healers will use abilities/cooldowns more, which makes it nearly ineffective).

Are you trying to say the health bubble a WAR gains in Defiance isn't a form of mitigation? O.o

Doesn't matter what spell or ability brings them up to max health, the healing recieved bonus is gravy compared to being able to eat an unmitigated buster.

[Tint]

Are you trying to say the health bubble a WAR gains in Defiance isn't a form of mitigation? O.o

technically... you are mitigating nothing with a health bubble. however it can help you survive, but only when A the health bubble is full and B you take more damage than the amount of life you have without defiance, wich is almost never the case. the healbuff and the access to Inner Beast is the real advantage of WAR tank stance.

[Kaethra]

I get the opposite: I get bullied for dps stance

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

That's why I'm of the mind that DPS ought to do the damage that is needed. Still groups get to decide what they want.

Makes them premade groups sound better and better.

[KaivaC]

Okay...this thread has definitely morphed into several different topics. Which is fine, because I'm at a point where I want to learn something anyhow. For all those stance dancers....since it's generally agreed upon that going DPS stance is the best way to maximize the potential of your tanks after your initial aggro combo, is anybody willing to provide specific advice? For example, I was a DRK main for the longest, but I was terrified of dropping stances if I was MT because I was worried of losing aggro. And that fear was one primary reason I quit tanking entirely. Picking up PLD, but that same fear is still there.

So for DRK and PLD...how should I be doing stance dancing? In dungeons as well as trials? Like, how can you be confident that you will not lose hate because of it? Because to be perfectly honest, now I'm afraid that what the OP experienced will happen to me.

[Reinha]

So for DRK and PLD...how should I be doing stance dancing? In dungeons as well as trials? Like, how can you be confident that you will not lose hate because of it?

In dungeons I go Sword Oath only on bosses, because on trash the tank can benefit from the mitigation of tank stance by pulling a lot. After one or two hate combos you can monitor enmity on the party list so no one can pull aggro without warning.



Trials however depend on the group. I've been to Shinryu ex practice parties where p1 autoattacks kill me as the OT in dps stance, after which I decided to go in tank stance just to see more mechanics and phases. Farm parties are probably more comfortable with everyone prioritizing dps. As a general rule it's good to be in tank stance for tank busters and adds.

[KrenianKandos]

In dungeons I go Sword Oath only on bosses, because on trash the tank can benefit from the mitigation of tank stance by pulling a lot. After one or two hate combos you can monitor enmity on the party list so no one can pull aggro without warning.



Trials however depend on the group. I've been to Shinryu ex practice parties where p1 autoattacks kill me as the OT in dps stance, after which I decided to go in tank stance just to see more mechanics and phases. Farm parties are probably more comfortable with everyone prioritizing dps. As a general rule it's good to be in tank stance for tank busters and adds.

...For FOUR years now I've tanked, and I had NO idea about this.

Wow. That is...something...

I wish they could make it so you can detach that from the Party menu and shove it in its own box similar to the dot threat one. Hell, merge both and make it that there's a name of a mob and then when you cycle, the name changes with the threat on said mob there.

Jebus...Thanks for the slap in the face. I always ignored the party bar when I'm tanking. I should start paying attention a tad more now...

[MoroMurasaki]

So for DRK and PLD...how should I be doing stance dancing? In dungeons as well as trials? Like, how can you be confident that you will not lose hate because of it? Because to be perfectly honest, now I'm afraid that what the OP experienced will happen to me.

To tack onto what Reihna said in 8man content with 2 tanks the OT can Provoke/Shirk the boss back on to you, basically taking your enmity lead and then giving it back with a bonus. Helps both of you stay in DPS stance longer. Just be sure not to lock yourself out of an upcoming tank swap with the 'voke CD.

Also I personally feel in 8man individual party members are more responsible for managing their own enmity as needed. I know there have been times on WHM that I pop Lucid not necessarily for the Refresh but just the enmity dump. If someone is pulling off of you it's generally reasonable to ask (or even check) to make sure they were popping Diversion and the like at appropriate times.

[HoodRat]

You are leaving yourself with more health than you would have had after a buster. If something would have taken 40k of your 52k and instead took 40k of your 70k you suddenly have a whole lot more wiggle room. Now you might live through a subsequent crit auto attack or a healer not being on the ball to get you back up right away.

I'm sorry but implying more health on a tank isn't useful is just not true. While the DPS contribution offered by Deliverance very often outweighs this advantage it is still undoubtedly an advantage when you're taking big hits.

The way I see it, defiance only works when you're at full hp or being healed...and even then it only increases healing spells and not healing abilities. While it does increase your max hp, it doesn't restore that hp. So, let's go back to your example and assume the war put on defiance during the cast of the 40k attack. While their max hp would be higher, unless they were healed or used equilibrium after putting defiance on but before taking the hit, they would still only be at 52k hp, whereas a pld or drk putting on tank stance midcast would have that 20% mitigation and only take 32k damage.

So for DRK and PLD...how should I be doing stance dancing? In dungeons as well as trials? Like, how can you be confident that you will not lose hate because of it? Because to be perfectly honest, now I'm afraid that what the OP experienced will happen to me.

Exactly what KaldeaSahaline says, for bosses do an enmity combo in tank stance then switch to dps stance. One thing I would like to add is that pld is the worst tank to pull with, so if you're on pld and have a second tank with you and they're not a pld, make them pull. :3

[Derio]

How did the OP know they kicked because of dps. Tank dps at that. In almost every case 2 good dps can carry a dungeon run even if the tank and healer are doing little to no damage at all.

[Hruodig]

Tanks are capable of putting out a non-insignificant amount of dps in this game. The fact is, once you're comfortable with the basics of tanking (holding aggro, positioning, becoming familiar with your cooldowns), pumping out dps is the next thing to focus on, and dropping your tank stance is the next step. It's something you just have to try, or else you'll never get comfortable with it.