Thread: Requesting Information on Jobs: Preparing for 1.21

Originally Posted by Rydin

Even if they cut cross class to 5... how much would that really hurt? Some classes are stretching to find 10 useful cross class abilities anyway...

The real limitation would come by limiting what classes you can cross class from, not the number alone. While the number would still hurt, it wouldn't hurt nearly as much unless you were restricted to specific classes as well.

Originally Posted by Starlord

The Question is are you Sure thats a BLM casting it?

BLM icon. Parenthesis on the text where I'm sure it says Black Mage (Thaumaturge) or vice versa. Also he uses Burst, which is BLM exclusive.

Silly Starlord...

Originally Posted by Starlord

Reserve Judgement? with that list, it feels like you already played 1.21 :P

no.. I call that bizarro 1.21.....
thats 1.21 in an alternate universe....
by reserving judgement... i mean 1.21 may be great...I can't say how much I love it until I play it....

This is just what came to mind when Yoshi first said "Jobs" but didn't give any actual info... like back in Spring 2011

Im still hopeful that jobs will be incredible though....
Just think of this as an alternate timeline of what could have been

Originally Posted by Starlord

I see what you did there :P

Yea... I still am very excited about Jobs and I think they'll be awesome
I just dont plan to do any soloing on classes
the main reason... I've been looking at plate and haubergeons celatas since October 2010... I wants me some JSE....
I want to run around in some new looking gear... Im never taking my Paladin AF off... Hell I wish I could craft in it

Originally Posted by Rydin

Thats actually one of the common criticisms of the Job system
One of my LS mates feels strongly about this.

In the beginning, classes were very beige and watered down....
Jobs were promised to us to add definition and identity to each class

But then in 1.20 the classes changed... and they became very defined and individualized.
So now jobs seem like they are just more of what we've been seeing from the classes....
For all intents and purposes... your role with a job in a party is exactly the same as your role would be with the corresponding class.
Ideally.. when I heard defined class roles I immediately thought since a class can do so many different things... Jobs would take just one of those and specialize
And everything in my heart wanted them to release 2 jobs per class

For instance..... Thaum could heal, nuke, DoT, weaponskill or debuff....
Thaum was DEFINITELY OP and did WAY too much
I was thinking they might trim it down so thaum could only Umbral weaponskill or DoT/debuff.
And then 1 thaum job would focus on DoTs and Debuffs (A green mage? if you will)
and the other thaum job would focus on TP, using melee to build TP and then unleash umbral weaponskills (A battle mage but not necessarily a red mage)

So Thaum (CLASS) would have less powerful DoTs and Umbral weaponskills...
green Mage (Job1) would have no added weaponskills but tons of powerful DoTs and Debuffs
And the battle mage (Job2) would have no added DoTs but more Umbral Weaponskills

But instead they made Thaums just nuke... and thats it.. and BLMs just nuke... and thats it...

Conjurer, as it originally was.... could have gone on to have 2 Jobs... BLM and WHM.
CNJ itself would have basic heals and elemental magic...and ALL advanced heals would be WHM only and ALL Ancient magic would be BLM only

MRD could tank and DD... so Ideally one job would put the focus on tanking while the other would be more for DD

PGL could have evolved into a 1 job that uses elemental and spirit attacks (Like a dragonball Z character?!?!?!?) and another that focused on straight physical hits in rapid succession...

Lancer could have gone the more jump/magic based dragoon as 1 job and the second job could have been a straight spear damager... I think they called it Uhlan in IZJS

GLD is up in the air... it could go to 2 different tanks... 1 with high HP and defense but no magic to speak of (Just a knight)... and another with big heals and damage mitigating spells (Paladin)
or.
GLD could have gone 1 tank job (Paladin) and 1 sword DD job (Dark Knight)

Archer is the odd man out....
Its job isn't just the same old same of the class.... which you would think is good....
But the thing is, Bard isn't a more specific role because archer doesn't inherently do anything that BARD specializes in...
Archer could have gone to a Ranger type ranged DD job... could call it "Hunter" and then also Bard... but to me Archer needs low level buffs if we are to believe Bard is a natural progression of that class

Its true...we have yet to see the Jobs.. they may take us all by surprise so I hold off judgement until I see them...
This is just the common criticism to the idea of jobs...and also what immediately came to mind when I heard about Jobs

tl;dr feels like Jobs aren't special roles... instead they are exactly what the class is (Except archer) with a few new abilities that fall right in line with what the class has already been doing

Current GLA is a solid, defensive tank.
PLD gains access to much greater defense, sure, but also very much unique White Magic abilities.

MRD is a sort of offensive tank and reliable DD.
WAR gains abilities that bolster the party's offense, add valuable crowd control, and solid AoE damage.

PGL is a solid solo class and a very effective, yet risky, DD. When played well it has the ability to do the greatest DPS.
MNK gains powerful crowd control through Sap, as well as abilities that further increase DPS directly - Hundred Fists & Kick.

LNC is a reliable, long-range melee DD that can safely deal damage, but relies on criticals to reach its potential.
DRG gains crowd control as well as safer damage dealing skills. It gains Jump. JUMP.

ARC is the longest range physical DD. It can deal low but reliable DPS from a safe distance. It has various crowd control skills.
BRD gains very valuable party buffs through various songs, as well as a seemingly very effective weapon skill.

THM is an offensive magic user that is most effective for spike elemental magic damage as well as crowd control. It's primarily good for getting through clutch moments and its weakness lies in its difficulty of ability to sustain long battles.
BLM is an offensive magic user with access to devastating Ancient Magic. It gains a very effective crowd control skill with Sleepga as well as a direct cover for THM's weakness with Convert, effectively turning it into a much more reliable DD with sustainable DPS.

CNJ is a defensive magic user which focuses on healing and buffing, but is able to access a number of offensive elemental nukes as well.
WHM gains essential White Magic, such as Regen, Esuna, and of course the very powerful Benediction which are all more than enough to separate it from the base class. It also gains a vital buff allowing it to more effectively keep its party safe with Chainspell and a likely powerful, costly nuke in Holy, which comes with a potent crowd control effect as well.



Yea.
I think the Jobs add plenty of skills that will drastically alter the playstyle in almost all cases.

Let's also not forget that there will be more jobs to be unlocked via the same classes.

Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

Current GLA is a solid, defensive tank.
PLD gains access to much greater defense, sure, but also very much unique White Magic abilities.

So your saying GLD is a tank... and by adding 5 more abilities you make it a better tank

Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

MRD is a sort of offensive tank and reliable DD.
WAR gains abilities that bolster the party's offense, add valuable crowd control, and solid AoE damage.

So MRD that can tank or DD (Including AOE), is given abilities to make it a better tank and DD (Including AOE)

Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

PGL is a solid solo class and a very effective, yet risky, DD. When played well it has the ability to do the greatest DPS.
MNK gains powerful crowd control through Sap, as well as abilities that further increase DPS directly - Hundred Fists & Kick.

So PGL has good DPS and Monk should increase DPS.....

Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

LNC is a reliable, long-range melee DD that can safely deal damage, but relies on criticals to reach its potential.
DRG gains crowd control as well as safer damage dealing skills. It gains Jump. JUMP.

LNC can DD from a distance, making it a safer DD... and DRG makes it an even safer DD

Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

ARC is the longest range physical DD. It can deal low but reliable DPS from a safe distance. It has various crowd control skills.
BRD gains very valuable party buffs through various songs, as well as a seemingly very effective weapon skill.

I don't know what to say about Bard until I see it in action... will be fun to try though

Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

THM is an offensive magic user that is most effective for spike elemental magic damage as well as crowd control. It's primarily good for getting through clutch moments and its weakness lies in its difficulty of ability to sustain long battles.
BLM is an offensive magic user with access to devastating Ancient Magic. It gains a very effective crowd control skill with Sleepga as well as a direct cover for THM's weakness with Convert, effectively turning it into a much more reliable DD with sustainable DPS.

once again... a magic nuker in whcih more spells equals more DPS

Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

CNJ is a defensive magic user which focuses on healing and buffing, but is able to access a number of offensive elemental nukes as well.
WHM gains essential White Magic, such as Regen, Esuna, and of course the very powerful Benediction which are all more than enough to separate it from the base class. It also gains a vital buff allowing it to more effectively keep its party safe with Chainspell and a likely powerful, costly nuke in Holy, which comes with a potent crowd control effect as well.

Still just sounds like more of the same

Im not saying Jobs aren't good... I'm just saying they dont specialize anything... they are just more of what we've come to expect from the classes
Yes they make this aspect or that aspect better....
But you know what else does that? Leveling the class from 1 to 50!!!

As you level a class, you gain new skills that make you better... new weaponskills, abilities, magic... but they all fall in line with the identity of your class... thats a description of leveling your class... and yet it sounds exactly like a description of Jobs....
I know I may get flamed for this... but jobs sound no different than raising the level cap and giving us those abilities as part of the class
Maybe it will change when I play them... but for now... it is what it is