With the sprint changes, what is the point of Fist of Wind?

[SpeckledBurd]

-Wrong information about potencies and stuff I already said about the good Quality of Life in Heavensward-

This is incorrect, Monk did not have increased potencies across the board, Monk had all of its potencies reduced by 10 or more. Every other job saw all of their potencies increased and gained new GCDs to compensate for the loss of a DoT except Monk.

Also Touch of Death added more depth to Monk compared to other jobs since it had a very real interaction with Demolish's timer which was fun to manage, especially at higher skill speed builds where you could use both Touch of Death and Fracture to delay your dot ticksw. What actually did replace it was Deep Meditation which really just feels like nothing, the double layered RNG nature of the skill means you get an extra forbidden Chakra every 50-80 seconds. We didn't even get an extra GCD in our standard combos to replace Touch of Death like Ninja and Dragoon both got.

As for what I said about Quality of Life, I didn't say that the Quality of Life skills we got in Heavensward are bad. They aren't, they're very very good and I legitimately don't understand how you can have Monk at lower levels without something like Form Shift, it's the single most essential of the job. My point was that the Quality of Life we got in Stormblood is bad. Riddle of Earth doesn't allow for flexible maintanence of GL3 like Transpose does for BLM, it's extremely rigid and can only be used in very specific situations because it requires the boss to hit you. Coupled with how short GL3 is it makes the ability incredibly unreliable outside of literally one fight (O4S phase 1), and then it can't be relied on to be up for the same situation again.

[MauvaisOeil]

We didn't even get an extra GCD in our standard combos to replace Touch of Death like Ninja and Dragoon both got.

Why nin ? Only drg got extra long chains of combos.

[SpeckledBurd]

Why nin ? Only drg got extra long chains of combos.

It got an extra Gust Slash added into it's combo rotation between Spinning Edge and Shadow Fang to compensate for the loss of Mutilate.

[RiceisNice]

This is incorrect, Monk did not have increased potencies across the board, Monk had all of its potencies reduced by 10 or more. Every other job saw all of their potencies increased and gained new GCDs to compensate for the loss of a DoT except Monk.
.

I could have worded it better; Twin snakes got an increase in the damage buff, which also affects auto attacks and oGCDs.

We didn't even get an extra GCD in our standard combos to replace Touch of Death like Ninja and Dragoon both got.

NIN doesn't get any new GCDs as far as I'm aware. DRG did get a 5th GCD in their combo as far as gameplay is concerned, but I was making a point in that alone didn't make up for the apparent dps loss of a DoT, or that it did but it wasn't enough since they were relatively underperforming that it needed a buff to begin with.

[SpeckledBurd]

I could have worded it better; Twin snakes got an increase in the damage buff, which also affects auto attacks and oGCDs.





NIN doesn't get any new GCDs as far as I'm aware. DRG did get a 5th GCD in their combo as far as gameplay is concerned, but I was making a point in that alone didn't make up for the apparent dps loss of a DoT, or that it did but it wasn't enough since they were relatively underperforming that it needed a buff to begin with.

Twin Snakes didn't get a buff, it just had the old Trait: Enhanced Twin Snakes folded into the Base Action. It was a 10% buff in Heavensward and ARR and that has not changed.

Ninja got another Gust Slash added between Spinning Edge and Shadow Fang. It wasn't much, but it's more than what Monk got.

[RiceisNice]

Twin Snakes didn't get a buff, it just had the old Trait: Enhanced Twin Snakes folded into the Base Action. It was a 10% buff in Heavensward and ARR and that has not changed.

Ok then.

Ninja got another Gust Slash added between Spinning Edge and Shadow Fang. It wasn't much, but it's more than what Monk got.

If you're coming from the perspective that monk hasn't gotten in extra ability to use in their rotation, then yes. Though it's not very clear cut since NIN essentially had the DoT from shadow fang baked into Dancing Edge and made into a third combo; all that really did was lower their effective dps gain if there was already a warrior (or if this change wasn't made, a samurai) in the group, in the end they're still doing less AE combos compared to before.

As far as speaking damage is concerned, this is a non-issue since adding an extra GCD/combo does not necessarily mean more dps as we saw with DRG, at least when it's not tuned right. Despite the above that MNK did effectively get lower potencies, it's it doesn't necessarily mean that it's underperforming as opposed to undesired or poorly designed. I was primarily arguing the former to someone else (thus if this is not the point you're making, everything we talked about in regards to potency above isn't relevant), since I do agree that as far as design is concerned, MNK definitely could have been done better because they effectively ran out of ideas if they have to add things like tackle mastery and improved chakra.

[wereotter]

It got an extra Gust Slash added into it's combo rotation between Spinning Edge and Shadow Fang to compensate for the loss of Mutilate.

Not entirely accurate, ninja got Shadow Fang combined with Dancing Edge. So the combo is now the Dancing Edge combo + DOT. The slashing debuff is, arguably, more important in the ninja rotation than the DOT. Ninjas now have fewer GCDs than they did in Heavensward. Stormblood added OGCDs for Ninja, all based around the Ninki gauge.