Built-in Parsers

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

It stands to reason the only people here arguing against my "better interests" are the ones who just unilaterally are saying no to parsers.

Now then, while you don't care to go back and forth on it (side note: same here), it's worth noting that - in a bubble - having a parser isn't going to help you learn a fight's mechanics faster (ACT callouts notwithstanding). It WILL help in identifying any issues with performance and I have not, nor will not dispute that. But I'd call it pretty hollow reasoning to claim someone's going to clear a fight first (from a mechanical standpoint) because they parse. If so, why do people die to things even with ACT callouts?

Yes, "people make mistakes". But people are also fully capable of learning HOW to clear a fight without callouts or a tool that helps measure performance. Again, how else would I or any "disadvantaged" console player have accomplished anything without all this time? Please note, again, this is NOT me saying "No parsers! Everything's fine! Console players can do anything!" I am very much saying we aren't inept and incapable of learning or playing without. That's it. That's really it right there. Not who learns faster, not who can clear quicker or more smoothly; my issues with the "disadvantage" begins and ends with the base idea of "can you do it?"

And we can.

[Deithwen]

snip

Just a few questions, do you believe that the World First group currently on undending coil don't need a parser ?
Do you believe that of all the players that killed O4S ( or any previous raids) didn't parse themselves at least at some point to improve their rotation or gameplay ?

Do you believe it's actually reasonable to say you can reach 100% of your job capabilities without any parser ? and thus clearing the content that requires that level of mastery ?

[MoroMurasaki]

...

Being able to clear something that someone else is able to clear is not the same as being on a level playing field. A group not using food or pot buffs might be able to clear the same content as a group who does use them but objectively the group using all the tools at tgeir disposal has an advantage over the group who does not.

You are mistaking equality of outcome (clearing a particular instance) with equality of opportunity (having the same tools available to use as anyone else with the same goal as you) and these things are not the same.

I said at the beginning of this exchange that it seemed as if you didn't understand what the word disadvantage meant. After this all I feel like that is still the core issue here. You could argue that not having parsers does not cripple PS4 players, you could back up that argument by finding a group of players clearing Savage content with absolutely no parsers involved but what you can't argue is the objective fact that walking into any situation with tons of less information than you could have is disadvantageous. If you want to try to simplify this into something that suits your narrative all you have to do is ignore all of what I've said and also basic definitions of words that elementary school children understand.

Recently GW2, As soon as parsers went allowed officially people startet to get Toxic. More toxic then it was before Got kicked for example with just 10%-15% DPS below Meta, and the bosses are even doable with 25%-35% below Meta.

Don't remember if it was oficially supported, but felt so, WoW, Raidgroups and people in dungeons got very toxic really fast. Classic was way more relaxed.

In Statics, Parsers are no issue, because you shgould find a static that meets your gamestyle. I would never join a Harcore Raid group. I'm just not good enough for it. But in the Midcore where I'm in we get our kills too. It just needs a bit longer. The problems start if people start flaming in Random Content.

Antecdotal and easily dismissed. Please bring something other than " in this other game someone was mean to me!" to the table if you're trying to make a point, the problem is your opinion isn't worth any more than another GW2 player saying it isn't toxic which, if I'm not mistaken, has already happened.

Anti parser crowd I'm still waiting for any factual argument against official parsers - not that there is one but let's see what you've got.

[Khemorex]

Antecdotal and easily dismissed. Please bring something other than " in this other game someone was mean to me!" to the table if you're trying to make a point, the problem is your opinion isn't worth any more than another GW2 player saying it isn't toxic which, if I'm not mistaken, has already happened.

Anti parser crowd I'm still waiting for any factual argument against official parsers - not that there is one but let's see what you've got.

Im still waiting for your scientific report where it says that people can handle a tool responsible without being a douche bag :P

[DeaconMoore]

Im still waiting for your scientific report where it says that people can handle a tool responsible without being a douche bag :P

People are people. You're going to encounter random jerks at times when doing a group with random people. I would hope however, you are capable of making some friends that aren't "douche bags" to run some content with.

[SDaemon]

Im still waiting for your scientific report where it says that people can handle a tool responsible without being a douche bag :P

Seeing as neither side of this issue has any sort of statistical backing to whether or not a parser will or will not improve a, or degrade b, or cause c etc etc. The line of argument is kind of pointless.

[Ilan]

Im still waiting for your scientific report where it says that people can handle a tool responsible without being a douche bag :P

Still waiting for the scientific report where it says that parsers make the community more toxic. If someone wants to be a dick he/she doesn't need a parser.

[akaneakki]

Im still waiting for your scientific report where it says that people can handle a tool responsible without being a douche bag :P

Still waiting for the scientific report where it says that parsers make the community more toxic. If someone wants to be a dick he/she doesn't need a parser.

And also Khemorex if you read my signature, it's you saying it's ''fun'' to wipe people all the time in pve content. Whos being a douchebag?

[Ilan]

And also Khemorex if you read my signature, it's you saying it's ''fun'' to wipe people all the time in pve content. Whos being a douchebag?

Well i would say the evidence speaks somewhat for itself.

Why don't we just stop discussing about parsers anyway? The people who are scared that they get outed..ehm i mean are against a parser...will always drag some examples into the picture that are to 90% imagination and the ones who are pro parser can explain things and negate these examples but ps4 players will still not get a parser because yoshi fate believes in these wild examples.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

3) I'm not saying a parser will be a jerk just for being a parser. Once again, and let me be perfectly clear right here, a parse is a tool. Bad people will use tools for bad reasons. Putting the tool inside of the game sends a signal to some, not all, such bad people that they are getting a thing that they want and thus must be right. Sounds like bad logic, right? The fallacy lies in those same individuals, not in the majority of parsers I have encountered.

This is the constant rebuttal I see and hate. We acknowledge parsers are a mere tool that can be used both positively and negatively dependent on the person yet it shouldn't be allowed because some people are assholes? If SE handles harassment reports properly, said jerks will be held accountable. What actually seems to be the divide, and I'm not claiming your stance here, is people don't want others to see how good or poorly they are performing. Case in point...

Im still waiting for your scientific report where it says that people can handle a tool responsible without being a douche bag :P

You aren't a "douche bag" for simply pointing to a parse and telling someone they need higher numbers. Alas, that is usually the argument made against parses, albeit in a roundabout manner. Futhermore, a lot of non-raiders are the ones complaining when if parses were added for pre-made parties only, wouldn't have any impact on them. Don't like the feature while farming for mounts? Turn it off. You'll still get plenty of people joining your party.

Edit:

all mistakes are recoverable, no game content has a no win scenario. so yes everyone needs to own up.

Story time!

Just the other night during our weeklies clears, I misread my buffs in Neo and Elusive Jumped with Allagan Field thinking it was Acceleration Bomb + Unbalance. The result was my death by flipping off the platform. This triggers Allagan immediately, spending a massive high damaging shockwave across the entire raid. Now, do explain how the healers, tanks or three other DPS are at fault for my mistake. I suppose our Scholar should've had telepathy and known to Rescue in that precise moment so I wouldn't fall off right?