Built-in Parsers

[Lazaruz]

I've already stated I don't really care either way whether or not parsers are officially supported or not. I only parse in my static, my group of friends. Your hostile attitude is exactly why people completely shove aside anti-parsers altogether and their arguments. Learn to actually read the entire post next time. I said specifically that "I don't want parsers because someone might yell at me," is a victim mentality, which is undeniably true. To immediately assume someone will bully or yell at you means you are already making yourself out to be a victim before it even happens.

Maybe you should chill out?

I could say the same as you're quite rudely assuming I'm just making everything up, when I saw it first hand in MMO's like WoW

As someone who played WoW for 8 years and raided heroic and then mythic for 4 of those years the idea that parsers lead directly to toxicity is utterly ridiculous. Were there instances of people using recount or skada to point out low dps and thus ridicule players? Yes, absolutely. However it was and is not common. I can probably count the amount of times toxicity was generated from one of those tools on one hand.

I envy whatever server you were on. As where I hung out it was a constant thing, not just in endgame content, but even dungeons used for leveling purposes.

I guess the "anecdotal evidence" is in both camps after all, eh?

[frostmagemari]

Yes because claiming everyone who doesnt agree with you have some kind of victim attitude is oh so productive

Or are you all just screaming because you cant tell people off for underperforming before you kick them?

You kind of proved a few people's points by your post... Just saying.

[Lazaruz]

You kind of proved a few people's points by your post... Just saying.

I'm not saying I didnt. I'm saying I resent the accusation that only "one side" is being a problem

[Oscura]

I could say the same as you're quite rudely assuming I'm just making everything up, when I saw it first hand in MMO's like WoW

There are people who claim for instance, WoW parsing totally ruined it and people are awful, but then there are people who claim that isn't the case, it's great to be able to parse whenever and that people still play as they want.

You can see here that I address that multiple different people will always have multiple different accounts.

I may have said "made up boogeyman," but the fact of the matter is that is my opinion. I've been playing this game since early access and only once have I ever seen drama regarding parsing.

Even if you felt I was being rude, being hostile over my opinion is exactly why people completely look over the anti-parsing crowd. Anyone who is anti-parsing gets incredibly defensive and takes things personally almost immediately. It's hard to empathize with that.

Edit: It also does not help that people who are anti-parsing are super offended by my post or keep arguing with it despite the fact that I agree that there will realistically never be a parser in this game and that I'm fine with it...

[Neocamp]

I envy whatever server you were on. As where I hung out it was a constant thing, not just in endgame content, but even dungeons used for leveling purposes.

I guess the "anecdotal evidence" is in both camps after all, eh?

Sargeras

[bswpayton]

I could say

i agree with you about the toxic part to be honest all you have to do is read the party finder discriptions. Bring the deeps, if you suck kick, if you hold us back kicked, two mistakes kicked , I totally understand and if everyone had access to a parse the talk would probaly get worse. But what you are forgetting is they could still enforce the rules of harassment which would make it to where once someone started harassing someone about their dps then they would get in trouble. You can have a parse system , and still enforce other rules just because you have one doesn't mean you cant have the other.

And also you cant be tryin to do endgame content and be soft, like Im not a top tank on floggs I wouldn't mind constructive criticism thats how you get better. If you doing hard content and if someone politely says something about your dps you should be able to take it in stride and report those whom are toxic if you like to report that type thing.

[Zarabeth]

well when someone ask for a personal parse for themselves then what would be the argument for the otherside exactly?

I would have no problem at all with personal parsers. The problem is when people use parsers to monitor other people's dps in order to judge them. Please don't try to tell me this doesn't happen as we both know it does. I'm glad FFXIV doesn't allow it as I hate to see people fight and be mean to each other. Not having a parser is just one less thing to use to bully others.

That said, I still would have no problem with a personal parser. I tend to use the striking dummies to see how i'm doing with my rotations and what I can do to add dps. It's not perfect, but it's there. I would even use a personal parser as long as it's just my own dps or healing that I'm seeing. There's no reason to see other's.

[kikix12]

"Oh stop with the victim attitude. Parsers are completely fine and never cause any issues ever except every MMO ever who fully allowed it proving otherwise"

"Oh stop with the victim attitude. PvP is completely fine and never causes any issues ever except in every MMO ever that allowed it proving otherwise."

- Typical Pro-PvP argument

See what I did there?! PvP undeniably does cause "toxicity" in community, as people start competing with each other and some take that a bit too far. Then the same goes for PvE, to which such a blank statement could be made. Or dungeon loot. Or cooperative mechanics. Or queue system like the duty roulette. Or being new...In the end, you can make such blanket statement on everything, so best just log off permanently...from the entire internet.

Nice thought?! Not really. That's why it's important to weight the "good" VS the "bad" and made decision based on that. Where is free will, there is ill will too, there is nothing that can be done that will not have instances of that.

Yeah sometimes it does suck that the majority gets punished for the actions of a few, but creating thread after thread after thread on this topic and in various ways just completely shutting down the concerns of the other side instead of actually adressing them, just makes people like OP seem like petulant kids throwing a tantrum because they cant have their favourite toy in the way they want.

This part shows that you didn't even bother reading past the title. Certainly not the many posts I made after the original one within the first three or so pages.
If you did...then what is "addressing the issue" to you?! Saying that parsers are no good?! That's ignorance at a level not worthy of discussion. Addressing an issue is looking for a way to minimize or remove it (impossible as it is entirely free will-based issue), while progressing with a plan. If a river floods the area near it every year but otherwise it's perfect for a settlement, addressing the issue is not finding a different spot. It's making something to stop the river from flooding the area, or make it as small as possible, to "salvage" at least part of the location, using the remainder for, like, rice plantation.

If you want a parser so badly. Play on PC and use ACT.

I want a parser that won't risk me losing the effect of the money and work invested because some random guy decided to be an asshole and another random guy didn't feel like doing their work properly investigating. I want one that would get me banned only if I actually acted like a jackass.

If you're not on PC then no, the game is litterally built around parsing software not being required, and trying to pretend otherwise is silly in the extreme

No one, certainly not me, said that parser is required to play the game. What I said is that some kind of calculation, which parsers make easier to do, is required to increase ones efficiency significantly. One can be a great player without parsers, but once that great player gets a parser, they may up their game even beyond that. On the other hand, a bad player even with parser may be hard-pressed to grow beyond the "average Joe/Jane"...but if they actually want to try, it's an easy way to get better.

Untill the day those advocating for parser software getting official implementation are able to even remotely entertain the opinion of the other side, then there's no point in even discussing this further as it's just gonna devolve into a shouting match

I have brought arguments one after another. This whole thread is entirely a suggestion on how to minimize the plausible negative impact of an in-game parser. And you? You didn't bring anything at all to the table. Only "Oh, he wants parsers, he's the pro-parser crowd that blindly suggest to implement it and doesn't care about us non-parser folk. He doesn't understand our blight and (yada yada yada...).".

[Stormfur]

As a PS4 player, I don't feel the least bit disadvantaged by not having a parser.

constantly parse checking, which I've unfortunately seen too many people get distracted by and pay the price for.

This is true. That's why I'd rather have a little screen at the end of a fight telling me how well I did. At least I'll know 1) I'm on the right track or 2) I need to improve. I don't want some kind of overlay. I have enough stuff on my screen to look at.

I don't feel disadvantaged since I know my rotation and such, but I'm not going to turn away a tool that could help, either.

And on that note, I'd love Reshade on the PS4. Those graphics are gorgeous.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

"Oh stop with the victim attitude. PvP is completely fine and never causes any issues ever except in every MMO ever that allowed it proving otherwise."

- Typical Pro-PvP argument

Allow me to step in on the PvP bit:

First, there ARE some players that take things to far, but that's hardly exclusive to PvP. I contend once more that with PvE comprising a larger portion of the game's content and community, one could argue that PvE effectively has more toxicity than PvP does. But no one wants to be lumped into such a broad statement, I'm sure.

Second, the PvP community, at least til 3.5, was rather small, and for that reason, we were pretty close knit. Sure we had our rivalries and whatnot, but due to how small we were, and more importantly, a respect for each other and the competitive spirit of the content we enjoyed, we were pretty civil. I fell back in love with PvP as I began to feel the raiding scene became very impersonal (where it was no longer about being part of a good team, but cherry picking and throwing away people based on whether they could get the job done or not). I made friends, not just teammates. FRIENDS. People I talk to outside of matches. People I flirt and joke with. People I help in PvE content, and even play other games with now. Don't demonize PvP based on negative stereotypes.