How's Ultimate?

[bswpayton]

No, you just continuously misinterpret the argument. Those "few thousand" are the players who make all the guides and help the .

I dono maybe people just want to make a living off of games they like. Games way more casual and easier have content streamers have you played swtor , thy are always called out for being to casual are not being challenging enough but that game makes more than this one and have streamers. You again are exaggerating how important these people are , or assuming they would just say oh I dont know I dont wana make money off this game anymore let me go do something else.

Streamers make content that is gona keep them afloat and if ff14 did that then they wouldn't just up and decide to leave. There will always be someone there limit break radio if you listen to them essentially hate this game but yet still base their show around it because thats what the fans want. So stop actin like if ultimate didn't exist then all of suddon people would stop makin any guides and content and what not on it. This game according to SE has the most subs its ever had, and this was before ultimate even came out, and the raid numbers didnt just grow so much that youd say it was all these raiders coming to the game from others.

So again you are just using the trickle down effect to support your argument when it really doesnt, people play this game for many reasons. You will always look at the game through a raiders point of view , and thats just not what brings people to the game there is no data supporting that argument none at all. The question is simple if the game scrapped ultimate and brought something else out that more people had access to and actually liked that was challenging enough. Then just based on numbers alone more people would be happy as opposed to the small amount thats all excited about ultimate.

And also its nothing different more people will still be grinding tomes and doing weeklys than doing ultimate and thats just a fact and u know this as well this content changed nothing for the majority.

[HyoMinPark]

Money and riches is something to get jealous about not some content in a video game. So youd be totally wrong on that one and so would anyone else, if I wanted to be jealuos of someone it would be a bill gates , or a mark zukerburg even then they worked for theres so it would be stupid to be jealous of them.

I am just simply sayin if they where going to go outside of the norm then make stuff that most people can actually play not something for even half of those whom raid in the first place cant even do. Everyone else got the same old stale content cycle while , the only new and fresh stuff cant even be done by anyone in the game hardly. This is about lack of playable content. If I where jealous id be whinning about neoexdeath, but I didnt make a peep about it I did the raids that are easiest to do on your own and was totally fine with that. I dont care if people get further, I just want content for more people than a few people dont see how thats really an issue.

If you aren’t jealous, then why aren’t you just letting this go? Why continue on this tirade?

Ultimate was not the center of 4.1’s release: that was the 24-man Ivalice raid and Shirogane Housing (which, since that affects the entire playerbase as a whole—and is an extremely limited asset in a completely broken system—why aren’t you complaining about it?). Eureka will come out in 4.2, and hopefully it won’t be another Diadem; I think it was a good decision on the developer’s part to delay its release if Eureka doesn’t flop as hard as Diadem did (twice)—because, if you want to talk about something making or breaking the game, if Eureka turns out to be another Diadem, FFXIV is going to suffer for it; I’m fairly confident on that.

The majority of this game has content that is tuned for the more casual side of the playerbase—even Savage and the Ex trials are getting easier so that the more softcore side of the playerbase can get into the content. And while that’s not necessarily a bad thing (content accessibility in general isn’t), the tilt towards everything getting easier is something that a lot of people are growing annoyed with. Raiders are allowed to have their content, too, every once in a while. Sorry that that hurts you you so much.

And, news flash: “money and riches” aren’t the only things one can be jealous of.

[bswpayton]

If you aren’t jealous, then why aren’t you just letting this go? Why continue on this tirade?

Ultimate was not the center of 4.1’s release: that was the 24-man Ivalice raid and Shirogane Housing (which, since that affects the entire playerbase as a whole—and .

If what your sayin is true then anyone whom hasnt cleared neoexdeath or v3s would just be bumping their gums. As Ive said again the fflogs data shows that there arent even more than 5 to 6 k parses on some of the most popular jobs from neoexdeath. So noone can say the raids are easier if they havent even cleared them, thats why i refute this argument the forums is just a voice.

While data from floggs is a much bigger indicated on whats considered hard and whats not, if you and your group find the raids easy then fine, but if you look at the data then it proves that its not as easy for everyone as you may believe it to be. The last time I saw anyone even on the forums complain about how easy the raid was , on release when aka the best players of the game where steam roling them. Months down the line the devs have stated people have struggled with three and four, and the data shows the same thing.

So again this many people thinking the content is easy is just a lie, or have no room to speak if they are still on v3s or exdeath and havent even finished the raid tier. Data is always more important than a couple of people coming to the forums talkin about how easy things are. The saying goes numbers dont lie and talk is cheap, so talk of whats easy means nothing when the data shows that its not.

[HyoMinPark]

If what your sayin is true then anyone whom hasnt cleared neoexdeath or v3s would just be bumping their gums. As Ive said again the fflogs data shows that there arent even more than 5 to 6 k parses on some of the most popular jobs from neoexdeath. So noone can say the raids are easier if they havent even cleared them, thats why i refute this argument the forums is just a voice.

Omega is easier than any of the Alexander raids, which also progressively got easier, with Midas being the best tuned out of the three. But since you failed to read my comments on that earlier, I’m not going to bother repeating them. It would just be a waste of words.

So again this many people thinking the content is easy is just a lie, or have no room to speak if they are still on v3s or exdeath and havent even finished the raid tier. Data is always more important than a couple of people coming to the forums talkin about how easy things are. The saying goes numbers dont like and talk is cheap, so talk of whats easy means nothing when the data shows that its not.

Your argument goes both ways. You haven’t finished the tier; haven’t even cleared V3S, since you said yourself you only did the “easier” floors. So who are you to speak on the difficulty of content you haven’t even done? I have cleared A11S and V3S—Halicarnassus was easier than Cruise Chaser. While I haven’t beaten Neo yet, I have seen GCO, so I’ve basically seen the entire fight (since his mechanics repeat after GCO with the exception of Neverwhere). While healing checks can be intense during things like Almagest and the Grand Crosses, I find the healing checks in A12S to be harder, content I have also done. I feel fairly confident speaking on these matters since I have actually done said content being discussed.

With regards to Gordias, ask anyone who raided at the time how difficult it was compared to Omega—the bosses in Omega all roll over compared to Living Liquid and Manipulator. Same for A8S and Brute Justice.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

thy are always called out for being to casual are not being challenging enough but that game makes more than this one and have streamers. You again are exaggerating how important these people are , or assuming they would just say oh I dont know I dont wana make money off this game anymore let me go do something else.

Citation needed. You really need to start making up your absolution claims, sweetheart. Regardless, of the three people I named, only one of them streams with any regularity. Most high end raiders who jump into PF or make job guides aren't streamers. Dervy did the vast majority of stat weights for HW yet he got paid next to nothing for his efforts. He did it to help the community.

thats just not what brings people to the game there is no data supporting that argument none at all.

Actually, I do. If you look at the speedkill scene, it's practically dead. Why? The hardcore raiders are bored. Don't just take my word for it, listen to Mogtalk where said raiders talk about it. Now before you go on claiming they don't represent a majority, I am well aware of that, but you're delusional if you don't think they impact the community overall. One of the primary reasons Gilgamesh grew into a mega server was due to Elysium's presence and it once being considered the "raid server." You can deny the trickle down effect all you fancy, but when you keep making this idiotic argument below...

The question is simple if the game scrapped ultimate and brought something else out that more people had access to and actually liked that was challenging enough. Then just based on numbers alone more people would be happy as opposed to the small amount thats all excited about ultimate.

For the last time, Ultimate uses recycled assets. How many times and how many people need to hammer that into your head? If they scrap Ultimate tomorrow, you get nothing. There wouldn't be new raids, new dungeons, Eureka or anything because Ultimate required minimalistic resources. This deluded notion Ultimate somehow detracted from the casual playerbase is... just that, delusional. The only one exaggerating here is you.

[Bernkastelx]

Its funny you bring up data when the parses have to be uploaded, and I can't say for the rest but if I was uploading a parse I would want it to be my best run. So bringing those numbers isn't really valid.

[bswpayton]

Omega is easier than any of the Alexander raids, which also progressively got easier, with Midas being the best tuned out of the three. But since you failed to read my comments on that earlier, I’m not going to bother repeating them. It would just be a waste of words.
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You said the key word you, but again floogs shows on plaidan which is one of the most played jobs in savage a 5 thousand player drop off from one to three, and a 10 thousand player drop off in neo exdeath. So again this is data you are going by your own personal experience and people that you know, when data shows that 10 thousand fewer people that started omega have completed the whole thing.

So what am I to do take your word over a glaring 10k player drop off on one of the most popular jobs in the game. Your word my word dont matter when there is proof online already, Im not the one who uses the word easy or undertuned on anything aside from dungeons because thats pretty much a fact its the most accessible content along with potd. I understand that my perspective on whats easy doesnt speak for whats actually being cleared and whats not but according to everyone here I guess data doesnt matter when it comes to their friends and own personal experience.

And as for me I went into v3s one time in a learning group and didnt want to pug it so I just didnt, just like you havent cleared neoexdeath doesn't mean I coudlnt also clear v3s. I just really dont like doing group content that much where i have to depend on other people , and dont like answering to people hence why I left a static I joined after a week Im very much a solo player I dont play the game to make friends (maybe one day that will change). But my experience doesnt matter just like yours does not either, nor anyone in this thread when the data alone speaks for itself on what is or isnt easy, that is a fact Im sorry you wont to disagree with data but it holds more weight than anyone on this forum could ever period.

@Bernkastelx

So your sayin take someones word over data? duh they have to be uploaded but I guess ten thousand fewer people where just to ashamed to upload their neo exdeath clears get out of here with that nonsense

[HyoMinPark]

You said the key word you, but again floogs shows on plaidan which is one of the most played jobs in savage a 5 thousand player drop off from one to three, and a 10 thousand player drop off in neo exdeath. So again this is data you are going by your own personal experience and people that you know, when data shows that 10 thousand fewer people that started omega have completed the whole thing.

So what am I to do take your word over a glaring 10k player drop off on one of the most popular jobs in the game. Your word my word dont matter when there is proof online already, Im not the one who uses the word easy or undertuned on anything aside from dungeons because thats pretty much a fact its the most accessible content along with potd. I understand that my perspective on whats easy doesnt speak for whats actually being cleared and whats not but according to everyone here I guess data doesnt matter when it comes to their friends and own personal experience.

Considering it’s also a fact that Omega Savage is easier than Creator, which was easier than Midas, which was easier than Gordias, AND that Gordias was overtuned (guess what? The developers themselves admitted that Gordias had been poorly tested and was far too overtuned given the gear available at the time), I fail to see how you can argue against those FACTS as well. They aren’t opinions.

And as for me I went into v3s one time in a learning group and didnt want to pug it so I just didnt, just like you havent cleared neoexdeath doesn't mean I coudlnt also clear v3s. I just really dont like doing group content that much where i have to depend on other people , and dont like answering to people hence why I left a static I joined after a week Im very much a solo player I dont play the game to make friends (maybe one day that will change). But my experience doesnt matter just like yours does not either, nor anyone in this thread when the data alone speaks for itself on what is or isnt easy, that is a fact Im sorry you wont to disagree with data but it holds more weight than anyone on this forum could ever period.

All I see here is you saying that you don’t want to cooperate with other individuals. And, if you don’t like doing group content where you don’t like to depend on other people, then why are you playing an MMO? You’re trying to talk about the difficulty or the ease of content that you haven’t even done—you haven’t even stepped foot into Neo. Did you do A12S when it was relevant? How about A11S? If the answer is no, then you cannot speak on the difficulty of the content because you lack the experience to do so.

If you want some data, let’s look at Lucky Bancho’s census data on V4S clears—which he has listed that about 4,000~5,000 more players have cleared V4S as compared to A12S. Of course, this data is also going to be off because Lucky looks at players that own the Savage mount, which is going to be lower than the actual number of clears since 1 mount drops to be rolled on between ~8 players. Same for FFLogs—some people don’t upload ugly parses; others don’t upload at all; some are even unlisted or private, and won’t show up in public rankings. You’re speaking in terms of absolutes, and you cannot do that. Your data doesn’t allow that.

Again, it’s not your choice what content is placed in the game and what content isn’t. At the most, Ultimate cost Patch 4.1 the inclusion of Perform earlier than 4.15. Ultimate did NOT cost 4.1 the release of Eureka; it didn’t cost the development of any “worthwhile content,” since the developers said themselves that the inclusion of Ultimate was NOT the reason for 4.1 including just one dungeon.

[Bernkastelx]

?

Ashamed? I know this might be hard to believe but maybe they don't care as long as its cleared?

[bswpayton]

Your data is wrong here: paladin is not the most played job in Savage—that title belongs to BRD by a landslide, and PLD doesn’t come anywhere close. Your data from FFLogs also proves it as such.

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I said one of not the most popular , so form the start you didnt even read what I said. And what I am sayin is simply that everything you just said is a good thing that more people are clearing. Why is that not a good thing, easier or whatever you want to call it , it doesnt matter its good for the game when more people are clearing the content. Im sorry you dont see that as a good thing, but it is hence the reason things are the way they are, and no its not my choice whats in the game and neither is it yours either and thank goodness.

Because the way youd want it is forever everything to be like ultimate and hardly anyone even clear any of the content in the game, obviously thats not good for business. You havent done ultimate so does that mean you cant take part in a discussion about it? Didnt think so content like we have now where more people have access and can clear it is the best for the game anyone who thinks otherwise can go do something else or leave or unsub and let everyone else enjoy clearing content. The fewer elitist we have the better if you ask me, get em out of here as far as Im concerned.

Let SE make content thats playable and clear able like they are doing now and hope they continue to do. Its funny to that you consider more people clearing content a bad thing , like ohhh way more people cleared neo exdeath ohh raids are so bad now. Like thats just a stupid thing to even consider being a bad thing, why do you think they added jump pots inclusion, why do you think they tuned the raids inclusion. They do these things to build a business not to appease some try hards that want everything to be tuned the way they see fit please let all of these people unsub so the rest of the players can enjoy the game because they are truely the cancer of this game. Because again for thousands of people neoexdeath isnt easy enough for them to get by which says the community as a whole is about on the level of a v3s, shinyru, v2s level and those who want something more had neo and will get more in the future. There was no reason to implement something else that is even beyond that , Im sorry but not sorry for those whom think things are to easy well just go play something else is all I can say. Just be thankful we even have raids honeslty many games dont even have them and still do fine , this game could vary well go the route of not doing raids at all. And it still wouldnt effect the subs, because many players dont give two craps about raiding, because look at how small the amount of people who raid is. So I am all for what they are doing now anything else is just tryin to suck up to a small portion of the playerbase that really is so small their opinions shoudlnt even matter.